T2 IRC Log: 2007-03-11

This is the log as captured by an IRC bot in the channel. The statements are those of the individual people and might not neccessarily reflect the policy and legal rules as set forth by the T2 SDE Project.

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--- Log opened Sun Mar 11 00:00:37 2007
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07:50 < Capey> rxr: some sched stuff is missing, might be more
07:54 < Capey> and network stuff
07:58 < Capey> those are the one's i encountered so far while building busybox
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11:19 < rxr> re
11:19 < rxr> this all built fine here
11:19 < rxr> Capey: even the whole desktop stuff containing T-Resc was built with the uClibc we have in trunk
11:36 < CIA-8> rene * r22901 /trunk/package/xorg/xorg-server/xorg-server.desc: * updated xorg-server (1.2.0 -> 1.2.99.901)
11:37 < CIA-8> rene * r22902 /trunk/package/xorg/xf86-video-i810/xf86-video-i810.desc: * updated xf86-video-i810 (1.7.4 -> 1.9.91)
11:40 < CIA-8> rene * r22903 /trunk/package/network/nagios/nagios.desc: * updated nagios (2.7 -> 2.8)
11:40 -!- AStorm [n=astralst@chello084010114027.chello.pl] has joined #t2
11:41 < CIA-8> rene * r22904 /trunk/package/network/nss_ldap/nss_ldap.desc: * updated nss_ldap (248 -> 255)
11:43 < CIA-8> rene * r22905 /trunk/package/security/openssh/openssh.desc: * updated openssh (4.5p1 -> 4.6p1)
11:47 < AStorm> Heh, this time I'll try with the t2 livecd as a base.
11:47 < AStorm> Is the t2-resc useful for that?
11:47 < rxr> t2-resc is a more specialized rescue setup
11:48 < rxr> using some non mainstream components such as uClibc, minit and kdrive X ...
11:48 < rxr> it is special, fast and l33t, ...
11:48 < AStorm> Hm.
11:48 < AStorm> Yep.
11:48 < AStorm> I'd use uclibc on the main system myself, except it doesn't have good NLS support.
11:48 < AStorm> Most everything compiles against it :-)
11:48 < AStorm> Or have you fixed the NLS support?
11:49 < rxr> not me
11:49 < AStorm> (also - does that work correctly on x86_64 with multilib?)
11:49 < rxr> good point, I have not tested uClibc multilib
11:49 < rxr> but was we do not have a 32bit uclibc counterpart I doubt :-)
11:49 < AStorm> I wonder... if binary apps linking against some 32-bit libc would work.
11:49 < rxr> the system will be pure 64bit
11:49 < AStorm> :>
11:50 < AStorm> It will do.
11:50 < AStorm> I'll just won't install Opera.
11:50 < AStorm> And kill my machine compiling OpenOffice :P
11:51 < AStorm> BTW, do you have that in non-binary form?
11:52 < AStorm> Their build system is... tricky.
11:53 < rxr> we only have OpenOffice from source
11:53 < rxr> in the past it used to build, then gcc-4.1 broke it
11:54 < rxr> I wanted to fix it before CeBIT next week but missed the time
11:58 < CIA-8> susan * r22906 /trunk/package/emulators/vice/vice.desc: * updated vice (1.20 -> 1.21)
11:58 < CIA-8> susan * r22907 /trunk/package/graphic/ufraw/ufraw.desc: * updated ufraw (0.10 -> 0.11)
11:58 < CIA-8> susan * r22908 /trunk/package/network/hylafax/hylafax.desc: * updated hylafax (5.0.4 -> 5.1.1)
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12:26 < rxr> hi d-marc
12:26 [Users #t2]
12:26 [@ChanServ] [ CIA-8 ] [ LMJ ] [ rxr ] [ Stelz ]
12:26 [ AStorm ] [ d-marc] [ mtr ] [ sepp ] [ TobiX ]
12:26 [ Capey ] [ emte__] [ R4gnar0k] [ Shingoshi] [ valentin]
12:26 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal]
12:28 < d-marc> hello!
12:32 < CIA-8> rene * r22909 /trunk/package/office/aqbanking/aqbanking.desc: * updated aqbanking (2.2.8 -> 2.2.9)
12:51 < CIA-8> rene * r22910 /trunk/package/network/pam_ldap/pam_ldap.desc: * updated pam_ldap (183 -> 184)
12:51 < CIA-8> rene * r22911 /trunk/package/graphic/asymptote/asymptote.desc: * updated asymptote (1.22 -> 1.23)
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13:05 < CIA-8> rene * r22912 /trunk/package/mail/ (8 files in 2 dirs): * renamed sylpheed-claws -> claws-mail
13:14 < CIA-8> rene * r22913 /trunk/package/mail/claws-mail/claws-mail.desc: * updated claws-mail (2.7.2 -> 2.8.1)
13:20 [Users #t2]
13:20 [@ChanServ] [ CIA-8 ] [ LMJ ] [ rxr ] [ Stelz ]
13:20 [ AStorm ] [ d-marc] [ mtr ] [ sepp ] [ TobiX ]
13:20 [ Capey ] [ emte_ ] [ R4gnar0k] [ Shingoshi] [ valentin]
13:20 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal]
13:22 < CIA-8> rene * r22914 /trunk/package/xorg/xf86-video-nv/xf86-video-nv.desc: * updated xf86-video-nv (1.2.2.1 -> 1.99.1)
13:28 < rxr> Hm, PSP Linux support is further than I thought: http://df38.dot5hosting.com/~remember/chris/
13:28 < rxr> maybe it's time to get one :-)
13:29 < rxr> especially as the damned Psion 5MX display flexray cable repair tweak I tried yesterday did not even overlived building the damn thing together again
13:29 < rxr> at least I now know the inside of the 5MX, that the PCB has 6 layers and that I'll never again buy a device fix flexible display plastic wire connection (tm)
13:31 < Capey> heh that psp looks cool... quite a high price tho
13:32 < Capey> quite accurate display
13:33 < rxr> looks on the linux progres for some time now, as I do not have the time for months of reverse engenieering myself anymore ...
13:33 < rxr> but with Linux a nice tool indeed
13:52 < CIA-8> susan * r22915 /trunk/package/gnome2/evolution/evolution.desc: * updated evolution (2.9.6 -> 2.9.92)
13:52 < CIA-8> susan * r22916 /trunk/package/gnome2/evolution-data-server/evolution-data-server.desc: * updated evolution-data-server (1.9.6.1 -> 1.9.92)
14:40 < CIA-8> rene * r22917 /trunk/package/xorg/xf86-video-glide/ (. xf86-video-glide.cache xf86-video-glide.desc): * added xf86-video-glide (1.0.0) - The Xorg Glide video driver
14:49 < rxr> re
15:24 < AStorm> Hmmm...
15:24 < AStorm> What would I have to do in order to add gcc-4.2.0-snapshot and gcc-4.3.0-snapshot to T2?
15:24 < AStorm> (yes, both)
15:24 < AStorm> Also older gccs.
15:25 < AStorm> Do you support "slots" of some kind?
15:27 < AStorm> Or should I add support for that myself?
15:27 < AStorm> A full development cross-system is required.
15:27 < AStorm> (I mean, I need one)
15:28 < AStorm> With multiple crosscompilers (arm, sh, x86, mingw, cygwin)
15:29 < AStorm> Also, different programming languages for each of these, where applicable
15:29 < d-marc> AStorm: I need that too ;)
15:29 < AStorm> and all 3 libcs
15:29 < AStorm> In multilib where applicable too.
15:30 < AStorm> T2 is currently too weak for that :|
15:30 < AStorm> Gentoo too, even more.
15:30 < AStorm> I'll try hacking T2.
15:43 < Capey> there has been some discussion on adding support for multiple package versions, but i dont know if thats ever implemented
15:45 < Capey> i know that target can override package versions but i'm not sure if thats what you want
15:54 < AStorm> It's definitely not what I want.
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17:10 < rxr> re
17:11 < AStorm> er
17:11 < rxr> well - when er forked off of ROCK Linux they had support for package forks
17:11 < rxr> however most of us found that so evil that we removed that feature
17:12 < rxr> basically it allowed adding conditionals into the package .desc and conf and build the package under an alias such as
17:12 < rxr> Build-Pkg gcc=gcc-42 and so on
17:12 < rxr> maybe you also think about what you need and we draft something perfect, not such an quick hack
17:13 < rxr> also we should add some "feature" so that binary packages are not downloaded for all architectures
17:13 < rxr> right now when you e.g. download some java binary package you get e.g. 4 downlods for x86, x86-64, ia64, ppc, ...
17:13 < rxr> idealy the build system should just download the one required ...
17:14 < rxr> ROCK Linux solves this with conditionls in the .desc like #if arch == x86-64
17:14 < rxr> however as I wrote a above this was soo evil that we reverted those fluff
17:14 < rxr> (it really caused eye cancer ...)
17:18 < rxr> http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9011975&pageNumber=1
17:34 < CIA-8> rene * r22918 /trunk/package/security/mod_auth_krb5/mod_auth_krb5.desc: * removed superflous, stray trailing - in mod_auth_krb5.desc's [P] tag
17:46 < CIA-8> rene * r22919 /trunk/package/develop/hte/hte.desc: * updated hte (2.0beta3 -> 2.0beta6)
17:53 < TobiX> Wow. 17 commits already today, I know projects that don't get this much commits in a month :)
17:54 < rxr> TobiX: :-)
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18:50 < CIA-8> rene * r22920 /trunk/package/x11/compiz/compiz.desc: * updated compiz (0.3.4 -> 0.3.6)
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19:28 < AStorm> rxr, I postulate something as simple as slots :>
19:28 < AStorm> A simple bash variable describing the slot, could be anything.
19:28 < AStorm> ="" by default
19:29 < AStorm> Each slot treated like a separate version of package.
19:30 < AStorm> The requirement is that one slot cannot overwrite the other's files
19:30 < AStorm> Which means that a package with ="" cannot be slotted at all.
19:30 < AStorm> The slottable packages could contain: [S] myslot
19:31 < AStorm> [S] 4.0.x
19:31 < AStorm> you could call it a [V] or [T], doesn't matter :>
19:32 < AStorm> Could be also used for different architecture binaries, if you wish so:
19:32 < AStorm> [T] x86-4.0.x
19:32 < AStorm> [T] x86_64-4.0.x
19:32 < AStorm> But then, the conditionals :P
19:33 < AStorm> I actually think that reading ebuild spec from Gentoo could help a bit in this regard. But keep the automatic build system.
19:34 < AStorm> (exception: add cmake support, should be simple - I'll work on that myself probably )
19:35 < AStorm> Other niceties would be: cvs/svn/git support.
19:35 < AStorm> As special URLs, maybe?
19:36 < AStorm> Sample: git://[USER@]HOST/REPO[#TAG]
19:36 < AStorm> http+git://...
19:37 < AStorm> svn://...
19:37 < AStorm> http+svn://
19:37 < AStorm> https+svn://
19:38 < AStorm> cvs://[:passwd:|something else][USER@]HOST/REPO[#TAG]
19:38 < AStorm> Whoops:
19:38 < AStorm> cvs://[:passwd:|something else][USER[:PASS]@]HOST/REPO[#TAG]
19:38 < AStorm> Other can have password too.
19:39 < rxr> we already support svn and git in [D] tags :-)
19:39 < AStorm> Good!
19:39 < rxr> and CVS
19:39 < AStorm> That's 80% of the work.
19:39 < rxr> git:// is only preleminary though ...
19:39 < AStorm> So, I'll add Darcs too :>
19:39 < AStorm> And Mercurial. Then it will be 99% complete.
19:40 < rxr> heh
19:40 < AStorm> Maybe, for evil people: sftp://...
19:42 < AStorm> Ok, now, I'll try _again_ to install T2. This time using the T2-Resc CD.
19:42 < AStorm> This should better work :>
19:43 < AStorm> (of course, in a chroot, not booting from it - I need x86_64)
19:44 < AStorm> rxr, anyway, have you considered adding that STAGE0-NO-CHECK flag I mentioned? I can provide a simple patch.
19:44 < AStorm> (for autoconf and some other package)
19:44 < AStorm> (that was flex, I think)
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19:49 < CIA-8> rene * r22921 /trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs):
19:49 < CIA-8> Tobias Gruetzmacher :
19:49 < CIA-8> * fixed some more shebangs to point to bash instead of just sh
19:51 < AStorm> rxr, which shebangs?
19:57 [Users #t2]
19:57 [@ChanServ] [ CIA-8 ] [ LMJ ] [ rxr ] [ Stelz ]
19:57 [ AStorm ] [ d-marc] [ mtr ] [ sepp_ ] [ TobiX ]
19:57 [ Capey ] [ emte__] [ R4gnar0k] [ Shingoshi] [ valentin]
19:57 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal]
19:57 < rxr> AStorm: of two build scripts and an mkinitrd invocation
19:58 < rxr> you can use svn diff -c 22921 to review this change easily
19:58 < rxr> this is for scripts that use bashisms ...
19:58 < AStorm> :-)
19:58 < AStorm> What do you consider bashisms?
19:59 < CIA-8> rene * r22922 /trunk/package/base/uclibc/uclibc.conf:
19:59 < CIA-8> Tobias Gruetzmacher :
19:59 < CIA-8> fixed uclibc build if NLS is not disabled
20:00 < AStorm> First, I have to fix the kernel issue that makes some times appear like 8,9+e09 in the future.
20:00 < AStorm> :>
20:05 < rxr> features that are "just in bash"
20:05 < rxr> btw. the patch is not from me anyway, I just commit that from the t2 list .-)
20:06 < AStorm> Is there some nice web interface around for me to look at the commits?
20:07 < CIA-8> rene * r22923 /trunk/package/perl/perl/strange-typo-fix.patch:
20:07 < CIA-8> Tobias Gruetzmacher :
20:07 < CIA-8> * fixed a missed quote in perl's makedepend.SH
20:11 -!- AStorm [n=astralst@chello084010114027.chello.pl] has quit ["I wasn't here, really, anyway."]
20:20 < TobiX> rxr: Thanks. You're fast :)
20:24 < rxr> sometimes .-)
20:33 < CIA-8> rene * r22924 /trunk/package/x11/cairo/cairo.desc:
20:33 < CIA-8> * updated cairo (1.2.6 -> 1.4.0), vast performance improvements and new
20:33 < CIA-8> functionality, tested to not cause regressions in the reference build
20:38 < CIA-8> rene * r22925 /trunk/package/network/webmin/webmin.desc: * updated webmin (1.320 -> 1.330)
20:38 < CIA-8> rene * r22926 /trunk/package/gnome2/exaile/exaile.desc: * updated exaile (0.2.8 -> 0.2.10b)
20:47 -!- spiff2323 [n=guillemp@40.Red-88-9-116.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #t2
20:48 < spiff2323> hello !
20:48 < rxr> hi spiff2323
20:48 < spiff2323> i need some advide with my first T2 build
20:48 < spiff2323> advice
20:49 < spiff2323> i already downloaded t2 sources (also burnt the T2 iso into a CD), and i'd like to build a Desktop distro onto which later add up my favourite apps
20:50 < spiff2323> is "Exact Desktop" my target distribution choice?
20:53 < rxr> yes, I would say so
20:53 < rxr> did you download some release or thr 6.0 branch or trunk?
20:53 < spiff2323> i did both, downloaded the binary for 6.0.1 (6.0.2 wasn't available for i386) and the sources
20:54 < spiff2323> for the same version
20:58 < rxr> ok - when you build this 6.0.x desktop you will get an installable CD, not live
20:58 < rxr> is that ok for you ?
21:04 < TobiX> Funny, my mailing list post generated SPF bounces... The mailing list software should probably not pretend to be me in front of SPF-aware hosts...
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21:05 < TobiX> Hmm... But it does not seem as if the mailing list software is at fault...
21:06 < spiff2323> yes, that's OK for me, i can anyway burn this ISO and install it on my HD, and later add mym fav apps
21:07 < spiff2323> i was reading the t2 manual to learn what packages are included in that target (yes i know i'm impatient ;-)
21:20 < rxr> TobiX: ah yes, noticed this once as well
21:21 < rxr> spiff2323: the package list are not listed in the handbook
21:21 < rxr> you can look what the desktop target does in target/desktop/pkgsel
21:22 < TobiX> rxr: Someone is using mail forwarding that is not SPF-aware (QSC seems to be at fault, methinks)
21:22 -!- d-marc [n=d-marc@HSI-KBW-085-216-120-220.hsi.kabelbw.de] has quit ["KVIrc 3.2.4 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/"]
21:25 < rxr> yeah - the t2 server is currently on a "private" QSC line
21:25 < rxr> this will change soon, I guess the problem will magically disappear then ...
21:26 < TobiX> So I must live with the fact that my mailing list posts will not reach people with properly configured SPF-aware mail servers...
21:27 < rxr> well - this will only last some more weeks
21:27 < rxr> I guess the only point to complain would be the QSC hotline, hm ?
21:35 < CIA-8> rene * r22927 /trunk/package/kde/basket/ (. basket.cache basket.desc): * added basket (0.6.0) - An application for organizing ideas
21:35 < CIA-8> rene * r22928 /trunk/package/develop/pwlib/pwlib.desc: * updated pwlib (1.10.3 -> 1.10.5)
21:36 < CIA-8> rene * r22929 /trunk/package/network/opal/opal.desc: * updated opal (2.2.4 -> 2.2.6)
21:37 < CIA-8> rene * r22930 /trunk/package/multimedia/ekiga/ekiga.desc: * updated ekiga (2.0.4 -> 2.0.7)
21:37 < TobiX> Yeah, if that ever gets through from first-level-support to the mail admin ;)
21:38 < rxr> yeah
21:41 < rxr> heh - lol
21:42 < rxr> I was just happy that basket built on the reference builder and now there already is basket-1.0 :-)
21:45 < CIA-8> rene * r22931 /trunk/package/kde/kalarm/kalarm.desc: * updated kalarm Url tag
21:54 < spiff2323> one more question, i've read it'll take around 1 day to build the generic one, is it really that long to build Exact Desktop too? just to make myself an idea
21:55 < rxr> depends on your CPU, disk and RAM
21:55 < rxr> the current ExactDesktop on a fast CPU (>2 GHz any brand) takes more than one days
21:55 < rxr> one day
21:55 < rxr> more like 2 days or so
21:56 < rxr> the generic build with all of our 2700 package takes half a week on a dual-core machine ... :-)
21:56 < spiff2323> wow...
21:56 < CIA-8> rene * r22932 /trunk/package/kde/basket/basket.desc: * updated basket (0.6.0 -> 1.0)
21:56 < rxr> the good old 2Ghz Athlon needs a week for a full rebuild of all packages ...
21:57 < spiff2323> can it be somehow paused-resumed ?
21:57 < rxr> either with OS suspend resume (of course)
21:57 < rxr> or when you shut down and then run Build-Target on some reboot the build continous on the last package that was interrupted
21:59 < spiff2323> great ! not that my dual core 3.4 isn't noisy, but my wife's a sharp ear and the computer's buzz annoys her
22:04 < spiff2323> i see that Generic Exact has 443 packages (not 2700) (based on pkgsel file)
22:11 < spiff2323> would then take less time?
22:11 < rxr> not Generic but Desktop yes
22:11 < rxr> the desktop just takes a day ++ a bit on a decent machine
22:11 < spiff2323> sry, i meant Desktop
22:11 < spiff2323> ok, thanks.
22:12 < spiff2323> i've configured it to use Pentium 4, will it make it much slower? is it worth the extra time compiling?
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22:19 < TobiX> rxr: Your mail headers seem to be awfully verbose... 'X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "grum.localhost" [...]'
22:19 < rxr> yeah
22:20 < rxr> guess we found a mail specialist here :-)
22:21 < TobiX> I was poking through the headers looking for which server would be the one that sends SPF-violating headers and stumbled upon yours :)
22:23 < TobiX> Hey, there are two spam reports in every mailing list post and SpamAssassin eats CPU for breakfast, so that is certainly worth fixing ;)
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23:35 < spiff2323> good nite all !
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--- Log closed Mon Mar 12 00:00:41 2007