--- Log opened Mon Mar 05 00:00:20 2012 01:15 -!- shevy [~shevy@178-190-72-77.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:28 -!- shevy [~shevy@88-117-33-21.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #t2 07:06 -!- mjungwirth2 [~mjungwirt@213.174.234.68] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:06 -!- mjungwirth [~mjungwirt@213.174.234.68] has joined #t2 10:19 < rxr> moin 11:20 < CIA-13> rene * r40285 /trunk/package/xorg/libfontenc/libfontenc.desc: * updated libfontenc (1.1.0 -> 1.1.1) 11:20 < CIA-13> rene * r40284 /trunk/package/xorg/inputproto/inputproto.desc: * updated inputproto (2.1 -> 2.2) 11:20 < CIA-13> rene * r40286 /trunk/package/xorg/libfs/libfs.desc: * updated libfs (1.0.3 -> 1.0.4) 11:21 < CIA-13> rene * r40287 /trunk/package/filesystem/lvm2/lvm2.desc: * updated lvm2 (2.02.93 -> 2.02.94) 11:21 < CIA-13> rene * r40288 /trunk/package/base/grep/grep.desc: * updated grep (2.10 -> 2.11) 11:34 -!- T-One [~T-One@213.33.91.2] has joined #t2 13:55 < rxr> 0re 13:55 < CIA-13> rene * r40289 /trunk/package/emulators/wine/wine.desc: * updated wine (1.4-rc5 -> 1.4-rc6) 13:56 < CIA-13> rene * r40290 /trunk/package/mail/nullmailer/nullmailer.desc: * updated nullmailer (1.05 -> 1.06) 13:57 < CIA-13> rene * r40291 /trunk/package/xorg/libpciaccess/libpciaccess.desc: * updated libpciaccess (0.12.1 -> 0.13) 13:57 < CIA-13> rene * r40292 /trunk/package/games/gnuchess/gnuchess.desc: * updated gnuchess (6.0.1 -> 6.0.2) 13:57 < CIA-13> rene * r40293 /trunk/package/xorg/libsm/libsm.desc: * updated libsm (1.2.0 -> 1.2.1) 13:57 < CIA-13> rene * r40294 /trunk/package/xorg/libice/libice.desc: * updated libice (1.0.7 -> 1.0.8) 13:58 < CIA-13> rene * r40295 /trunk/package/xorg/libxfont/libxfont.desc: * updated libxfont (1.4.4 -> 1.4.5) 13:58 < CIA-13> rene * r40296 /trunk/package/x11/xvkbd/xvkbd.desc: * updated xvkbd (3.2 -> 3.3) 13:59 < CIA-13> rene * r40298 /trunk/package/network/openldap/openldap.desc: * updated openldap (2.4.29 -> 2.4.30) 13:59 < CIA-13> rene * r40297 /trunk/package/network/aria2/aria2.desc: * updated aria2 (1.14.1 -> 1.14.2) 13:59 < CIA-13> rene * r40299 /trunk/package/games/wesnoth/wesnoth.desc: * updated wesnoth (1.10 -> 1.10.1) 13:59 < CIA-13> rene * r40300 /trunk/package/multimedia/live/live.desc: * updated live (2012.02.04 -> 2012.02.29) 15:26 -!- T-One [~T-One@213.33.91.2] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:28 -!- dougmencken [~username@93.123.156.139] has joined #t2 15:28 < dougmencken> hello, guys! 15:28 < dougmencken> I plan to switch to your distro :) 15:36 < dougmencken> Checked out revision 40300. 15:42 < dougmencken> http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/1060/t2configuring.png 15:44 < dougmencken> cksum-test (bzip2): download/mirror/l/linux-2.6.37.tar.bz2 ... hmm ... the kernel is old 15:48 < dougmencken> Downloading linux26:download/mirror/l/linux-3.2.tar.bz2 ... 15:49 < dougmencken> didn't get it? headers from 2.6.37, but the kernel itself - 3.2?.. 15:49 < dougmencken> okay, let's look where it goes 16:55 -!- dougmencken [~username@93.123.156.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:00 -!- username [~username@93.123.156.139] has joined #t2 17:00 -!- username is now known as dougmencken 17:03 < dougmencken> oh, I don't need samba at all 17:04 < shevy> dougmencken yeah wait a little until rene is here :D 17:05 < dougmencken> it looks like that downloading sources will take forever, so okay ;) 17:05 < dougmencken> especially with my connection (very unstable) 17:07 < dougmencken> also, I haven't found the answer in FAQ, but... why is this distro called "T2"? 17:08 < dougmencken> I met it via this article: http://lwn.net/Articles/395894/ 17:10 < dougmencken> I'malso trying to build my own distro: http://manulix.wikidot.com/ 17:11 < dougmencken> (currently, it's only a chroot environment; but I'm sure I can learn a lot from T2) 17:19 < dougmencken> thunderbird too :) mutt is enough 17:20 < dougmencken> how long would it all take to compile? 17:21 < dougmencken> having a reference time: gcc does 3-stage bootstrap for ~4 hours on my side 17:23 < dougmencken> shevy: is rene the only one developer? 17:25 * dougmencken also wonders about benh... where is he how... what does he do... he did ~3/4 of all powerpc-related code in linux back in mid 2000s 17:32 < dougmencken> kdebase? oh 17:33 < dougmencken> I just need plain x.org, a liitle gtk+2 (3?) 17:51 < shevy> dougmencken there are some others but he is the most active one and most often around here 17:52 < shevy> dougmencken I never got into the "mainstream" distributions, so I developed a habit of interest in alternative solutions, like gobolinux, nixos, t2. I am not a dev though, programming is just a hobby, mostly for things I need to have solved more conveniently 17:52 < shevy> and most of the time in the programming language Ruby 17:53 < dougmencken> heh, that's why I've chosen this distro 17:54 < dougmencken> not Ruby :) and even not Lua ... but the point that there's no chance in "mainstream" distributions if you don't use mainstream cpu arch 17:57 < shevy> you write in a language? 17:57 < shevy> I got tired of the big distributions 17:57 < dougmencken> english is nont "my mama's tongue" :) 17:57 < dougmencken> not* 17:57 < dougmencken> shevy: for prog lang, I do know C/C++, Java 17:58 < dougmencken> powerpc assembly 17:58 < shevy> aha 17:58 < shevy> the classical programmer :) 17:58 < dougmencken> for big distributions, looks like I'm tired too 17:59 < dougmencken> kind of ;) 17:59 < shevy> let me show you a funny error I had recently 17:59 < shevy> from firefox: 17:59 < shevy> configure: error: Can't find header GL/glx.h for WebGL (install mesa-common-dev (Ubuntu), mesa-libGL-devel (Fedora), or 17:59 < shevy> Mesa-devel (openSUSE)) 17:59 < shevy> What's wrong with this picture? ;) 17:59 < shevy> 3 different names for the same thing 18:00 < shevy> big distributions == curse 18:00 < dougmencken> is this some game? like nether earth? 18:00 < shevy> haha 18:00 < shevy> they just like to name them differently 18:00 < shevy> the distributions create their own ecosystem of incompatibilities purposely 18:00 < dougmencken> the problem is that NE remake can't into autotools :) 18:00 < shevy> yet on the other hand they claim to want to "standardize" on FHS and LSB 18:01 < shevy> my answer to them is 18:01 < shevy> distributions must die! 18:02 < dougmencken> the fact is they are needed ("easy distros"), at least to attract "non-power" users 18:02 < dougmencken> the real problem is contributing for them 18:02 < dougmencken> a lot of "rules", a total ignorance, etc. 18:03 < dougmencken> it's much easier to send patch to upstream and watch how it is applied 18:03 < dougmencken> rather than trying to contribute the same patch to "maintainers" 18:06 < dougmencken> ah, your message is from firefox... heh, they do use autotools 2.1 (from 90s) 18:06 < dougmencken> and the bug about migration to at least 2.6 has a very importance flag 18:06 < dougmencken> but nobody (including me, I even promised to try to fix) cares 18:08 < dougmencken> oh, judging from http://t2-project.org/packages/ T2 doesn't care much about being free 18:08 < dougmencken> I hope that non-free stuff just doesn't exist for non-x86 :) 18:09 < dougmencken> acroread - A PDF Reader9.3.4officeRestricted 18:10 < dougmencken> ^^^^ why is this thing needed at all? we do have xpdf, we do have evince 18:11 < shevy> I am using it :) 18:11 < shevy> neither xpdf nor evince compile for me right now 18:11 < shevy> xpdf would have been nice but it is more or less abandoned 18:11 < shevy> evince has too many gnome dependencies, that is a damn pain 18:12 < shevy> the less gnome ecosystem I have to use the better for my mental health 18:12 < dougmencken> okay, then TeXworks' PDF viewer :) 18:12 < shevy> tex, never got that one to work 18:12 < dougmencken> \emph{hmm...} 18:12 < dougmencken> % ;) 18:12 < shevy> argh 18:13 < dougmencken> so you're not on powerpc? 18:14 < dougmencken> also, a lot of kde stuff is downloading, so I think that having gtk+ stuff is a less pain 18:14 < dougmencken> or are T2 devs kde fans? ;) 18:14 < shevy> never had a powerpc 18:15 < shevy> I hate kde too nowadays, just less than gnome 18:15 < shevy> I switched to the Xfce camp 18:15 < dougmencken> I do use e16 actually 18:15 < shevy> yeah enlightenment is interesting 18:15 < shevy> I hope they can avoid the madness in kde and gnome 18:15 < dougmencken> very nice WM, with a capabilities of mixing tiling and windowed WMs 18:17 < dougmencken> ibm-jre-131 - IBM Java 1.3 Runtime Environment1.3.1-SR10-1javaRestricted 18:17 < dougmencken> ^^^ and ... who does need this? 18:17 < dougmencken> icc - The Intel C/C++ Compiler9.0.030x86Commercial << is definitely not for me, but anyways :) 18:21 < dougmencken> phew 18:22 < dougmencken> now ./scripts/Build-Target -cfg system 18:22 < dougmencken> qmake :) 18:22 < dougmencken> Building tools in build/.../TOOLCHAIN/tools.cross << why cross? 18:26 < dougmencken> nice sound of fan spinning at full rpms :) 18:27 < dougmencken> http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/928/t2buildstart.png 18:32 < dougmencken> == 03/05/12 12:31:36 =[0]=> Finished building package flex. 18:32 < dougmencken> I'd bet it would be ~2 days. 18:35 -!- bobbytux [~bobbytux@ARouen-553-1-160-199.w90-23.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:35 < dougmencken> == 12:32:16 =[0]=> Building develop/binutils [2.20.51.0.11 9.0-trunk] == 03/05/12 12:34:35 =[0]=> Finished building package binutils. 18:36 < dougmencken> well, nice; in LFS world, time for binutils is counted as 1 unit 18:43 < dougmencken> an error 18:45 < dougmencken> http://pastebin.com/VaQLdvwC 18:46 < dougmencken> Cannot find GMP version 4.1.3 or higher. << but scientific/gmp [5.0.2 9.0-trunk] has been built 3 steps above 18:47 < dougmencken> When compiling the GMP library, do not forget to enable the C++ interface: add --enable-cxx to the configuration options. << maybe this is a problem? 18:49 < dougmencken> stat: cannot stat `build/system-9.0-trunk-desktop-powerpc64-G5-linux/root/var/adm/logs': No such file or directory 18:49 -!- bobbytux [~bobbytux@ARouen-553-1-144-9.w92-152.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #t2 18:49 < dougmencken> stat: cannot stat `/root/var/adm/logs': No such file or directory 18:55 < dougmencken> ~/t2_distro/t2-trunk/src.ppl.system.20120305.123926.26519.g5/ERROR-LOG >> http://pastebin.com/LhYU8g3j 18:56 < dougmencken> checking how to link with libgmpxx... << this is a spot 18:56 < dougmencken> we do really need --enable-cxx for gmp 18:57 < dougmencken> how to edit ./configure options for gmp? 18:57 < dougmencken> for T2 18:58 < shevy> hmm 18:59 < shevy> I dont know how T2 does it 18:59 < shevy> in my build scripts for gmp, I tend to use: 18:59 < shevy> "--enable-cxx --enable-mpbsd --enable-static --disable-shared --build=x86_64-linux" 19:00 < dougmencken> shevy: how to get which ones is used in T2? 19:00 < dougmencken> ~/t2_distro/t2-trunk/src.ppl.system.20120305.123926.26519.g5/ppl-0.11.2/config.log >> http://pastebin.com/index/LhYU8g3j 19:01 < dougmencken> and a request of enhancement: can you provide a short description about the package being build? like me does 19:02 < shevy> dougmencken no real idea, we have to wait for rxr I suppose 19:02 < shevy> I failed to build the latest GCC for instance 19:02 < shevy> the new dependencies go on my nerves :\ 19:02 < dougmencken> for example: http://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/manulix/scripts/build-scripts/PKGINFO/pkginfo-gmp 19:03 < dougmencken> shevy: for example? I did a 4.7 testing a lot 19:03 < shevy> I am on 4.6.1 still 19:03 < dougmencken> oh :/ 19:04 < dougmencken> since 4.5, gcc requires mpc, that's all 19:04 < dougmencken> what are " the new dependencies" you're about? 19:05 < dougmencken> maybe does it worth to send my error to mail list? 19:07 < shevy> my notes so far are: 19:07 < shevy> gmp,mpc >= 0.8.1,ppl 19:07 < shevy> especially ppl 19:07 < shevy> dougmencken, the latest gcc surely requires some ppl* crap 19:07 < shevy> parma something 19:07 < dougmencken> gcc doesn't require it, just belive me :) 19:08 < shevy> when you want to compile gcc from source 19:08 < shevy> you can not continue after configure phase if you do not have these 19:09 < shevy> configure: error: Building GCC requires GMP 4.2+, MPFR 2.3.1+ and MPC 0.8.0+. 19:09 < shevy> Try the --with-gmp, --with-mpfr and/or --with-mpc options to specify 19:09 < dougmencken> correct, but not ppl 19:09 < shevy> hmm 19:09 < shevy> one of these requires ppl I think 19:10 < shevy> I dunno how, but somewhere ppl is needed 19:10 < shevy> I remember some cloog-parma error thing and did not have that in older gcc 19:10 < dougmencken> you think, I know, look here: http://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/manulix/binpkg-powerpc/ 19:10 < shevy> I want to use llvm :( 19:10 < dougmencken> I never knew about ppl 19:10 < shevy> ok where is gcc 4.6.3 there 19:10 < dougmencken> ah, llvm 19:11 < dougmencken> [#0006] 58467.6K 2012-01-23 gcc_snapshot v4.7.0-89ba950 (gcc_snapshot-v4.7.0-89ba950-powerpc-uclibc.binpkg.tar.bz2) 19:11 < dougmencken> I don't upload it, coz it can't build working uclibc 19:11 < dougmencken> I tried 4.6.2, it was okay; but it's the past 19:12 < dougmencken> okay, getting 4.6.3 19:12 < shevy> hehe 19:12 < shevy> the past 19:12 < shevy> :D 19:13 < shevy> I remember the gcc 3.x days 19:13 < dougmencken> me too 19:13 < shevy> even gcc 2.x something, I think I even got it to work years ago 19:13 < dougmencken> and even 2.x 19:13 < shevy> now gcc is just huge and annoying 19:13 < dougmencken> shevy: hey! it's now much better 19:13 < shevy> man 19:13 < shevy> things always get worse 19:13 < shevy> KDE 4 now requires boost too if you want to compile it 19:13 < dougmencken> better (faster and smaller) code, in a lot of improvement with automata 19:14 < shevy> smaller where! 19:14 < shevy> gcc-3.4.6.tar.bz2 27 MB, gcc-4.6.3.tar.bz2 69 M things just grow and grow and grow. KDE is even worse here than gcc, at least gcc is critical whereas I can opt out on KDE 19:14 < shevy> oh and I did not even mention gnome yet 19:14 < shevy> did I? :D 19:14 < dougmencken> shevy: would you belive me? 19:15 < dougmencken> not the gcc itself, but the reult 19:16 < dougmencken> The following are sizes, in bytes, of classpath binary packages built from the same srcpkg with GCC 4.5.2 and GCC 4.6.0, respectively: 19:16 < dougmencken> {{**12310721** @@2011-02-22 23:32 classpath-v0.98-powerpc-uclibc.binpkg.tar.bz2@@}} 19:16 < dougmencken> {{**12264371** @@2011-03-20 14:40 classpath-v0.98-powerpc-uclibc.binpkg.tar.bz2@@}} 19:16 < dougmencken> The following are sizes, in bytes, of make (v0.82) binaries built with GCC 4.5.2 and GCC 4.6.0, respectively: 19:17 < dougmencken> {{**161820** @@2011-02-22 23:57 usr/bin/make@@}} 19:17 < dougmencken> {{**159188** @@2011-04-16 08:27 usr/bin/make@@}} 19:17 < shevy> dougmencken dunno 19:17 < shevy> I dont trust things much these days anymore 19:17 < dougmencken> you can try it by yourself, I'm not sure how is it on x86 scene 19:18 < dougmencken> just use the same config, the same source tarball 19:18 < shevy> hehe 19:18 < shevy> I compile statically usually when possible :) 19:20 < shevy> wheee 19:20 < shevy> you play wesnoth? :D 19:20 < shevy> I hate to mention it but 19:20 < shevy> it used to be smaller and leaner ;) 19:20 < shevy> it's quite nice though, I played it quite a bit 19:22 < dougmencken> shevy: of course, I do 19:22 < dougmencken> even was on ladder 19:22 < dougmencken> douggie is my nick there 19:22 < shevy> hehe 19:22 < shevy> did you play warcraft 3 by chance? 19:22 < dougmencken> nope 19:23 < dougmencken> globulation2 maybe? 19:23 < dougmencken> nexuiz? 19:23 < dougmencken> (all that's free software) 19:30 < dougmencken> I'm now bootstrapping gcc 4.6.3 inside manulix' chroot 19:31 < dougmencken> my build commands >> http://pastebin.com/au8nDvT5 19:57 < dougmencken> looks like IRC is really sleepy; any hope mailing list would be quicker? 20:00 < shevy> I have no idea 20:00 < shevy> I never used any mailing lists since my 8 years on freenode IRC 20:00 < dougmencken> okay :) 20:00 < shevy> dougmencken, rene is usually here 20:01 < shevy> I dont have timespans in my IRC log but he was here :P 20:01 < shevy> rene * r40299 /trunk/package/games/wesnoth/wesnoth.desc: * updated wesnoth (1.10 -> 1.10.1) 20:01 < shevy> rene * r40300 /trunk/package/multimedia/live/live.desc: * updated live (2012.02.04 -> 2012.02.29) 20:01 < shevy> hello, guys! 20:01 < shevy> see he did some commits before you joined 20:01 < dougmencken> oh 20:01 < shevy> but as I dont have time stamps, and have a dynamic IP where I get regularly disconnected, I really have no idea when anything was said :) 20:02 < dougmencken> shevy: can I /query you for wesnoth 1v1 game? 20:02 < dougmencken> ;) 20:02 < shevy> dougmencken I could not get boost to compile 20:02 < shevy> and since my habit is to compile everything from source, I could not get the new wesnoth to work either :( 20:02 < shevy> but when it works eventually, sure :) 20:02 < dougmencken> what's wrong with boost? 20:03 < shevy> I am not sure, it is annoying me to no ends 20:03 < shevy> when software annoys me, I get angry and throw it away for a while. after some time, usually a few weeks, I give things another try 20:03 < shevy> but until then I am just very angry 20:04 < dougmencken> okay okay, dude 20:04 < dougmencken> I'm usually begin to try to fix it 20:09 < dougmencken> shevy: I suppose you can understand it when you'll be on non-x86 arch :) 20:13 < dougmencken> oh, my build system isn't adopted for multicore machines 20:29 < dougmencken> happy then, I can watch 1080p videos while gcc is bootstrapping; I'm now wathcing "Amelie" ;) 21:14 < shevy> well 21:14 < shevy> I am only alternating between x86 and 64 21:14 < shevy> mostly I am on 64 these days 21:17 < dougmencken> then you had lost a lot of "unsupported" stuff :) 21:17 < dougmencken> our only hope is free software 21:18 < dougmencken> for example: starcraft 2 is not avial for powerpc 21:18 < dougmencken> (even on os x, not to mention gnu/linux) 21:18 < dougmencken> and! even plants vs zombies 21:18 < dougmencken> I do play it via qemu 21:19 < dougmencken> emulating a windows machine, having stolen a copy of windows XP 21:19 < dougmencken> just to be able to play plants vs zombies 21:20 < dougmencken> and! I asked for pvz for powerpc; I even said I'd pay $100 for it 21:20 < dougmencken> they ignored me (popgames' team), never answered 22:22 < dougmencken> finished gcc 4.6.3 22:23 < dougmencken> it doesn't require ppl 22:30 < dougmencken> I'm goind to bed now; see you --- Log closed Tue Mar 06 00:00:20 2012