--- Log opened Tue Nov 08 00:00:03 2005 --- Day changed Tue Nov 08 2005 00:00 < mnemoc> rxr: the reason of X LIBC not working is the forced difference between perl/ repo and perl package 00:07 -!- sparc-kly|Univ [n=mubex@66-50-123-218.prtc.net] has joined #t2 00:58 < CIA-12> amery * r13215 /trunk/target/generic/config.in: * improved generic/template to cache .awk files, instead of regenerate them on each loop 01:24 -!- sparc-kly|Univ [n=mubex@66-50-123-218.prtc.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 01:25 < CIA-12> amery * r13216 /trunk/target/generic/config.in: * changed generic to hide sorting prefix on templates, added on r13214. so this number is not considered on config file 01:25 < mnemoc> is 13216 too obscure? 01:25 -!- ojh [n=omer@71-34-239-173.eugn.qwest.net] has joined #t2 01:26 < mnemoc> wb ojh 01:26 < ojh> mnemoc: Hi 01:31 < ojh> I have a small ROCK-PLUG related issue. When I plug in a device that creates a device node in /dev/usb/tts/ the permissions are set to 600 so only root can access the port. ROCK-PLUG needs a script to set the permissions on USB TTY devices. In my cast its the cradle for my Palm Pilot. 01:33 < mnemoc> iirc that goes on /etc/modules.conf 01:34 < mnemoc> /etc/modprobe.conf 01:35 < madtux> o.o 01:56 < mnemoc> isn't a mode=666 there? 01:57 < madtux> u mean mode=mnemoc ? 01:58 < ojh> mnemoc: Odd thing is I don't see /etc/modprobe.conf on my ROCK 2.0.0 system . . . 02:00 < mnemoc> strace -vvfF modprobe foo :) 02:00 < mnemoc> see what file yours reads 02:02 < ojh> mnemoc: query_module("usbserial", QM_INFO, {address=0xe0c38000, size=18012, flags=MOD_RUNNING|MOD_USED_ONCE, usecount=0}, 16) = 0 02:03 < ojh> IC, now that reviewed what strace does . . . 02:46 -!- sparc-kly [n=mubex@64.237.248.53] has joined #t2 02:49 -!- madtux [i=manolo@pf0.hostarica.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 04:35 -!- mubex [n=mubex@64.237.248.53] has joined #t2 05:31 -!- ojh [n=omer@71-34-239-173.eugn.qwest.net] has left #t2 [] 05:48 -!- mubex is now known as [sparc-kly] 06:18 -!- ideal [n=idealm_@222.66.46.90] has joined #t2 06:19 < ideal> Congratulations for the release. 07:10 -!- Netsplit herbert.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: [sparc-kly], valentin, owl, morfoh, jsaw, SerWou, karasz, _Ragnar_, ideal 07:10 -!- Netsplit over, joins: ideal, [sparc-kly], morfoh, jsaw, karasz, SerWou, owl, _Ragnar_, valentin 07:22 -!- Netsplit herbert.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: valentin, [sparc-kly], owl, jsaw, morfoh, SerWou, _Ragnar_, karasz, ideal 07:22 -!- Netsplit over, joins: ideal, [sparc-kly], morfoh, jsaw, karasz, SerWou, owl, _Ragnar_, valentin 07:32 -!- mtr_ [n=Michael@p54AFC38C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #t2 07:48 -!- mtr [n=Michael@p54AF8A5B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:30 < jsaw> re 09:31 < jsaw> mnemoc: /etc/rockplug/config/usb.usermap -> last column 09:45 < valentin> moin 09:54 < jsaw> hi valentin 09:55 < jsaw> symlink! 10:06 < valentin> hi jsaw 10:11 < valentin> quite short news on symlink 10:16 -!- geekitus [n=geekitus@83.179.133.149] has joined #t2 10:20 < jsaw> valentin: have a few secs? 10:22 < rxr> hi 10:22 < jsaw> g'morning rxr 10:23 < rxr> valentin: yes - I submitted a 2nd longer one - but after 4 days the picked the first news ... 10:23 < rxr> symlink.ch seems to be in low contributor / holidy mode or so .. 10:23 < rxr> hi ideal - thanks 10:23 < jsaw> I have a question concerning t2 configuration, esp. networking/wlan 10:24 < rxr> jsaw: yep ? 10:24 < jsaw> got interupted... 10:24 < jsaw> I wonder, if we could develop some kind of xml or whatever description, 10:24 < jsaw> that could also be used by knetconf 10:24 < valentin> for what ? 10:24 < jsaw> the problem: 10:25 < jsaw> while the wep interface is standartized, wpa settings are different for all wlan drivers... 10:26 < jsaw> the other possibility that comes to mind, is that we package a "translation" tool per wlan driver (some script...) 10:27 < jsaw> hmmm.... download/mirror/p/psi-0.9.3_zh.qm.cksum-err 10:27 < jsaw> actually download/mirror/p/psi-0.9.3_*.qm.cksum-err 10:28 < jsaw> any ideas for the WPA thing? 10:28 < rxr> well - just wait to get those interfaces streamlined ... 10:29 < jsaw> you think they'll gonna be streamlined any time soon? 10:29 < jsaw> (I think that's a _couple_ of years ahead) 10:32 < rxr> my hope and feeling is that wifi in vanilla kernel get's a lot of work and integration recently 10:32 < rxr> until then we could provide multiple keywords or autoprobing of the interface to use ... 10:32 -!- CIA-12 [n=CIA@70.85.31.102] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)] 10:32 < rxr> I would not supply additional state information 10:36 < jsaw> ic 10:37 < jsaw> but that still requires some "translation" mechanism 10:38 < jsaw> I rather hesitate to put everything into "wireless.sh"... 10:40 < rxr> wpa.ssh 10:40 < rxr> -s 10:40 < valentin> jsaw: how would you use those xml records inside rocknet ? xml with bash ... 10:44 < jsaw> the current netconf for wpa is to use the explicit command used to set up the wlan card. That means, I would not use it with bash, only the user interface for setting it up uses the description. 10:45 < jsaw> I expect the person editting the netconf by hand to know what he's doing... :) 10:46 < jsaw> I think, especially with wlan, the user interaction is cruicial. 10:47 < jsaw> You cannot expect WLAN to be somewhat near static. 10:47 < jsaw> Ethernet is easy with dhcp. 10:47 < jsaw> WLAN sadly is not. 10:49 < rxr> also more and more organizations run some ipsec of w-lan ... 10:49 < rxr> we need config for that as well ... 10:49 < jsaw> I have wlan at home and at the institute. We have three APs, and different nets (one without password on a vpn). Which one do I choose? .... 10:49 < jsaw> I already have some kind of auto-detection. 10:50 < jsaw> But it's specific for my wlan adapter... 10:50 < rxr> valentin: can I call in 10m when I finished glueing the scanner ? 10:51 < jsaw> gotta do some more brain storming... hmmm 11:12 < rxr> ,-) 11:20 -!- CIA-9 [n=CIA@flapjack.navi.cx] has joined #t2 11:22 -!- morfoh [n=jeru@p54BEE60C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 11:35 -!- ideal [n=idealm_@222.66.46.90] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 11:36 < jsaw> cu later 11:43 < rxr> cu jsaw 11:43 -!- CIA-9 [n=CIA@flapjack.navi.cx] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 11:44 -!- CIA-1 [n=CIA@flapjack.navi.cx] has joined #t2 11:46 -!- ideal [n=idealm_@58.33.53.101] has joined #t2 11:47 [Users #t2] 11:47 [ [sparc-kly]] [ geekitus] [ karasz] [ owl ] [ SerWou ] 11:47 [ _Ragnar_ ] [ ideal ] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ sparc-kly] 11:47 [ CIA-1 ] [ jsaw ] [ mtr_ ] [ sepp_] [ valentin ] 11:47 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal] 11:49 < karasz> moin all 11:49 < rxr> mon karasz 11:50 < karasz> hello rxr 11:50 < karasz> i was wondering if i shouyld save something from power? 11:53 < rxr> hm 11:53 < rxr> how long will it be around 11:53 < rxr> I could copy the binary archives back on my sever 11:54 < rxr> but - well - we do not really need them since when we have permanent powerpc64 boxes we can quickly rebuild them ... 12:03 -!- [sparc-kly] [n=mubex@64.237.248.53] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 12:08 < CIA-1> rene * r13219 /trunk/package/mail/sylpheed/sylpheed.desc: * updated sylpheed (2.0.3 -> 2.0.4) 12:09 -!- sepp [n=sepp@p213.54.207.14.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #t2 12:10 < CIA-1> rene * r13220 /trunk/package/x11/fox/fox.desc: * updated fox (1.4.20 -> 1.4.22) 12:10 < CIA-1> rene * r13218 /trunk/package/audio/xmms-jack/xmms-jack.desc: * updated xmms-jack (0.14 -> 0.15) 12:10 < CIA-1> rene * r13217 /trunk/package/develop/gambas/gambas.desc: * updated gambas (1.0.9 -> 1.0.12) 12:10 < karasz> it will be around til 10 november 12:11 < karasz> rxr do you have use for the file layout of a Debian bootable cd for openpower? 12:12 < karasz> since you said that the boot target needs tickering... 12:14 < CIA-1> rene * r13221 /trunk/package/perl/perl-unicode/perl-unicode.desc: * updated perl-unicode (2.07 -> 2.09) 12:14 < rxr> karasz: yes - that could help 12:14 < karasz> how should i do that? 12:14 < CIA-1> rene * r13222 /trunk/package/perl/perl-html-parser/perl-html-parser.desc: * updated perl-html-parser (3.45 -> 3.46) 12:15 < karasz> make a tar and post it on my web? 12:15 < karasz> or you can grabb it from openpower? 12:17 < rxr> what you prefer 12:17 < rxr> did you verify the CD works on your box ? 12:17 < rxr> I guess I can download, right? 12:17 < rxr> I could test on my rs6k as well 12:18 < rxr> since the T2 CD is only bootable with a tiny manual quirk on the IBM rs6k on my side 12:18 < rxr> is it a ppc or ppc64 cd ? 12:18 < karasz> ppc64 12:18 < karasz> loaded on power 12:18 < karasz> you can check it now 12:19 < CIA-1> rene * r13223 /trunk/target/ (desktop/config.in livecd/default.pkgsel): * added mesa-demos (glxinfo and glxgears) to the livecd and desktop target 12:19 < rxr> hm - if you have a cd writer and cd-r/rw handy we could indeed modify and test the 2.1 bootdisk on ppc64 if you have the spare time 12:21 < karasz> just a min talking on the phone :( 12:22 < rxr> hehe ,-) me too 12:26 < karasz> sadly i don't think that we can test it because the morons from IBM did't sent me the passes for the bios 12:26 < karasz> anyway 12:26 < karasz> i loaded the cd on power but i guess that you will find more usefull the iso, no? 12:27 < karasz> i am copying that to power too 12:29 < karasz> but i have some spare time :D 12:29 < karasz> and some CPU ticks to spare ... 12:29 < karasz> so if you wanna try something just let me know 12:32 -!- sepp_ [n=sepp@p213.54.212.163.tisdip.tiscali.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 12:35 < karasz> hehe hehe hehe 12:36 < karasz> i am honored.... 12:36 < karasz> T2 2.1.0 "Charlotte" released 2005-11-04 12:36 < karasz> my bday ^^ 12:36 < karasz> hehe 12:46 < rxr> your baby ? 12:46 < karasz> no, just me :) 12:46 < karasz> i mean the date not the year ofcourse 13:05 < owl> moin 13:07 -!- madtux [i=manolo@pf0.hostarica.com] has joined #t2 13:08 < owl> hi madtux 13:08 < madtux> Hi owlita 13:08 < owl> how are you? 13:09 < madtux> i'm good, yourself? 13:09 < owl> alive i guess. thx. did i meantion that i'm really loving the hi-fi system of my car? ;) 13:10 < madtux> u did not not, but now i know 13:10 < madtux> what kind of car have u? 13:10 < owl> madtux: a golf III joker (with an extra-hi-fi system) 13:11 < owl> you? 13:11 < madtux> audi tt 13:12 < owl> hehehe 13:12 < madtux> ;-) 13:12 < owl> my dad works at audi ;) 13:12 < madtux> really? thats cool 13:12 < owl> yeah. he's doing stuff with 3d-measurement or something... 13:12 < owl> (technical stuff at least) 13:13 < madtux> ask daddy if he can talk at his job for a sponsored "testing car" 13:13 < madtux> :) 13:13 < owl> *lol* test what? t2 in audi-board-computer? ;) 13:13 < madtux> that sounds like a plan 13:13 < madtux> :) 13:14 < madtux> just find an excuse to get an audi :) 13:14 < owl> hehe. i guess that will not work ;) 13:14 < madtux> u'll never know if u don't try :) 13:15 < owl> ;) well. he's just a worker, so... ;) 13:15 < madtux> good point 13:15 < owl> ;) 13:25 < karasz> rxr did you finished your phone call? 13:26 < rxr> yep 13:26 < rxr> and lunch in the meantime ,-) 13:26 < karasz> cool 13:27 < karasz> so what about the boot stuff... 13:30 < rxr> karasz: just leave me a bit more time - right now I work on some aspects of the livecd 13:30 < rxr> can I come back to you in let's say 1 or 2 hours ? 13:31 < karasz> ofcourse 13:31 < karasz> i am not pushy you know me by now ;) 13:46 -!- rxr_ [n=rene@e178143068.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2 13:46 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.0 RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ 13:46 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Fri Nov 4 16:55:33 2005] 13:46 [Users #t2] 13:46 [ _Ragnar_] [ ideal ] [ madtux] [ owl ] [ sepp ] [ valentin] 13:46 [ CIA-1 ] [ jsaw ] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ SerWou ] 13:46 [ geekitus] [ karasz] [ mtr_ ] [ rxr_] [ sparc-kly] 13:46 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 16 normal] 13:46 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 21:15:33 2004 13:46 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 11 secs 13:50 < karasz> reboot 13:51 -!- karasz [n=karasz@80.97.102.202] has quit ["I cna ytpe 300 wrods pre mniuet!!!"] 13:56 -!- karasz [n=karasz@80.97.102.202] has joined #t2 13:59 -!- rxr [n=rene@e178160012.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:20 -!- Netsplit calvino.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: valentin, owl, jsaw, SerWou, madtux, _Ragnar_, karasz, sepp, ideal 14:20 -!- Netsplit over, joins: karasz, madtux, sepp, ideal, jsaw, valentin, _Ragnar_, owl, SerWou 14:27 -!- sparc-kly[g3] [n=tux@66-50-123-218.prtc.net] has joined #t2 14:55 < rxr_> jsaw: mnemoc: anyone here ? 15:00 < CIA-1> sebastian * r13224 /trunk/package/multimedia/jahshaka/ (jahshaka.desc qmake.patch): 15:00 < CIA-1> * workaround for a qmake bug 15:00 < CIA-1> * marked jahshaka NOPARALLEL 15:02 < mnemoc> moin! 15:02 < madtux> mnemoc, ! 15:03 < mnemoc> rxr_: did you saw what i did on generic/templates processor? 15:03 < mnemoc> madtux: !! 15:06 < mnemoc> rxr_: i hope to haven't been to obscure 15:10 -!- Baldzius [n=mx@85.206.100.182] has joined #t2 15:10 < Baldzius> moin 15:11 < karasz> moin Baldzius 15:11 < Baldzius> moin karasz 15:23 < jsaw> re 15:23 < rxr_> mnemoc: yes - but I did not fully review it 15:23 < jsaw> rxr_: ? 15:23 < rxr_> mnemoc: I hack the pkgsel processor up right 15:23 < rxr_> now 15:23 -!- You're now known as rxr 15:24 < rxr> for 2.2 I think we should obsolete old-style direct sed filtering 15:24 < rxr> and I wanted to convert the livecd to use $target/pkgsel 15:24 < rxr> though I have several issues with that 15:25 < rxr> how did you both intended those to be used? 15:25 < jsaw> rxr: rev? 15:25 < rxr> e.g. I think mnemoc prefers O * and then enable stuff 15:25 < rxr> however this does not work when you want sane default for architecture specific packages and glibc32 ... 15:26 < rxr> also X base/* enables all sort of fluff due to matching categories 15:26 < rxr> can we agree that the pattern should only match the repository/pkgname and that if we ever need to match other flags introduce other syntax for that ? 15:26 < jsaw> I'd think, removing an entry is fine if the basic strucuture of the target requires it 15:27 < rxr> and what are your proposals for sane defaults for architecture specific stuff and libcCs ? 15:28 < jsaw> Hmmm 15:28 < jsaw> You don't want to build uclibc if the target is glibc based, e.g. 15:29 < rxr> jsaw: nope - I want to select e.g. base/* with the defaults the pacakges have there ... 15:29 < jsaw> you mean, the defaults in $target/pkgsel ? 15:30 < jsaw> I do not yet see the problem...then... .oO(?) 15:31 < jsaw> run $target/pkgsel first, then the user selected stuff... ? 15:31 < rxr> tell me how to write a pkgsel that disables all but base/* 15:31 < rxr> or that enables base/* with it's defautls 15:34 < jsaw> the first one I have to check myself, 15:34 < jsaw> but the second one??? why would you want that? 15:35 < jsaw> if the $target/pkgsel is sane first, you don't need to reenable it...!? 15:36 < rxr> ? 15:36 < rxr> I talk about writing the target pkgsel ... 15:37 < jsaw> so, you mean, in case everything is disabled, then re-enable per repo wise? 15:40 < rxr> for example 15:42 < rxr> for now I restrict the pattern to the repo/pkg, ok ? 15:43 < jsaw> so only explict pkg addition and removal? no removal or enabling of complete repos? 15:45 < rxr> yes reps of course 15:45 < rxr> but currently the pattern matches the category as well 15:45 < rxr> which sucks at least for me 15:45 < jsaw> hmm, ic 15:46 -!- geekitus [n=geekitus@83.179.133.149] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:47 < jsaw> okay with me for now. Later, however, I'd like to have exactly the opposite, of course, with a finer grained category. 15:48 < jsaw> btw, 15:48 < jsaw> if you're at it, change the generated rule (from pkgsel_parse) to sth. like this: 15:48 < rxr> it is already changed a lot .. 15:49 < jsaw> ( $5 ~ /base\/[^\/]*/ ) Â{ $1='X' } 15:49 < jsaw> then, you can also do 15:49 < jsaw> ( $5 !~ ... 15:49 < jsaw> which deselects everything but... 15:52 < rxr> can you paste the diff you intend ? 15:54 < jsaw> hmmm 15:54 < jsaw> do you give some hours to re-understand the logic of pkgsel_parse? 15:55 < jsaw> - address="" ; first="( " ; others="&& " 15:55 < jsaw> no, forget this 15:57 < jsaw> do we, at any time, need this complicated pkgsel_parse? 15:57 < jsaw> did anybody ever see some pattern with "&&" generated? 15:58 -!- sparc-kly[g3] [n=tux@66-50-123-218.prtc.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:00 < rxr> jsaw: nope 16:00 < rxr> jsaw: I simplify them right now 16:00 < rxr> jsaw: if we ever want more complex stuff let's do it then 16:00 < jsaw> good :) 16:00 < rxr> jsaw: did you intended to allow negative matches? 16:00 < rxr> like O all bug base/* ? 16:01 < jsaw> you were the one that asked for it...don't you? 16:01 < rxr> yes 16:01 < rxr> but your sentence indicated you intended s.th. like that in the past ... 16:03 < jsaw> no, I just glanced at the awk manual... 16:04 < jsaw> mnemoc: opinions? 16:05 < jsaw> btw, there are new trac entries for 2.1.0-stable 16:06 < rxr> from whom ? 16:06 < rxr> btw. we need trac email notifications ... 16:07 < jsaw> two end-user 16:07 < jsaw> (that just downloaded 2.1.0-stable) 16:08 < jsaw> we should also check if some of the errors have been resolved... 16:09 < jsaw> gotta go, cu later 16:10 < rxr> cu 16:11 < rxr> jsaw: still here? 16:12 < rxr> I think I'll implement inverted matches 16:12 < rxr> O !base/* = 16:12 < rxr> ? even 16:12 < rxr> O !base/* ? 16:13 < karasz> rxr do you plan to be here in the evening too? 16:16 < karasz> i have to go now, but i will be back 16:17 < karasz> in the mean time rxr if you need something from power help yourself 16:18 < karasz> i put an iso in your home, it is a debian boot with some knoppix live cd for pSeries and OpenPower 16:18 < karasz> you can find the cd too in media 16:18 < karasz> cu, i will be back in aprox 1,5h 16:19 < rxr> yes - I'll be often around 16:36 -!- Baldzius [n=mx@85.206.100.182] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:01 -!- sepp_ [n=sepp@p213.54.218.177.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #t2 17:01 -!- sepp [n=sepp@p213.54.207.14.tisdip.tiscali.de] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:11 -!- g2 [n=g2@cpe-066-057-008-035.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #t2 17:15 -!- g2 [n=g2@cpe-066-057-008-035.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit] 17:20 < rxr> hey - after rewriting pkgsel_parse and tweaking and tweaking of the pkgsel of livecd I'm down to 25 differences to the previous sed list .. 17:36 < rxr> ok - well - now we have a 30 minute info talk about T2 on the linux world expo ,-) 17:47 -!- MisterN [n=MrN@p549CF8A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2 17:48 < MisterN> hi 17:55 < rxr> hi 17:56 < MisterN> rxr: how far from good is the new livecd? 17:59 -!- CIA-1 [n=CIA@flapjack.navi.cx] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:00 -!- CIA-14 [n=CIA@flapjack.navi.cx] has joined #t2 18:00 -!- ideal [n=idealm_@58.33.53.101] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:04 < rxr> MisterN: not far ,-) 18:05 < MisterN> rxr: while my main reason is hotplug++, i want to try this thing *g* 18:21 < karasz> re moin 18:26 < rxr> puh - finally ... 18:26 < rxr> +X rc 18:26 < rxr> +X gtk+12 18:26 < rxr> +X gtk+ 18:26 < rxr> +O libdvdnav 18:26 < rxr> +O autotrace 18:26 < rxr> +X bashcompletion 18:26 < rxr> the difference of old style, ugly package selection on the live cd and the new style pkgsel with a lot of pkgse_* function adaptions to make useful selection possible ... 18:31 < karasz> rxr i am back, if you need me whissle ;) 18:32 < rxr> well, .. 18:32 < rxr> karasz: I worked on the stupid pkgsel stuff for too long 18:32 < rxr> karasz: I fear I do not have too much time left today for powerpc64 18:32 < karasz> but it is turning out good isn't it? 18:32 < rxr> karasz: is tomorrow ok as well or should we work on it today ? 18:32 < rxr> karasz: yep 18:32 < karasz> tomorrow is ok 18:32 < rxr> though I hope mnemoc does not complain I rewrote the pkgsel_parse nearly completely ... 18:33 < rxr> karasz: ok - because I wanted to go to the swimming hall with susan today .. 18:33 < karasz> usualy mnemoc does not like that ;) 18:33 < karasz> have fun 18:33 < CIA-14> rene * r13225 /trunk/scripts/Build-Target: * fixed Build-Target fuser on log files 18:34 < karasz> morons from IBM lost the password :D 18:34 < karasz> hmmm go figure 18:36 < rxr> ? 18:37 < karasz> they lost the bios password 18:37 < CIA-14> rene * r13226 /trunk/scripts/config-functions.in: 18:37 < CIA-14> * rewrote most parts of pkgsel_parse: do only match on repository/package 18:37 < CIA-14> and not use categories. So base/* only matches on the base repository 18:37 < CIA-14> and not the many base/* categorized packages. Allow inverted matches 18:37 < CIA-14> via ! (O !base/*) and to get the packages' default state (e.g. 18:37 < CIA-14> depending on the architecture). In my opinon this makes pkgsel way 18:37 < CIA-14> more useful to use. 18:38 < CIA-14> rene * r13227 /trunk/target/livecd/ (default.pkgsel pkgsel): 18:38 < CIA-14> * converted the livecd target from old-style custom sed package 18:38 < CIA-14> filtering to pkgsel map 18:38 < karasz> i guess that in the end it turns out well cause today i have planned some db2 group tickering 18:38 < CIA-14> rene * r13228 /trunk/target/livecd/rootfs/sbin/init.d/system: * fixed livecd init.d/system overlay's #! ... 18:39 < karasz> so maybe it is even better tomorrow to fiddle with boot 18:39 < karasz> rxr i read some docu abt that debian and i didn't kiked it very much.... 18:40 < karasz> http://karasz.pastebin.ca/28009 18:40 < karasz> ^^ doesn't sound too encouraging... 18:42 < karasz> guys and girls (owl ;) ) i am interested in a little chit-chat about kernels 18:42 < karasz> anyone inyterested? 18:45 < rxr> karasz: what details do you wanna chit-chat ? 18:48 < karasz> hmm basic stuff i guess 18:48 < CIA-14> rene * r13229 /trunk/target/livecd/config.in: * removed former explicit pkgfilter form the livecd/config.in 18:48 < CIA-14> rene * r13230 /trunk/target/livecd/build_image.sh: 18:48 < CIA-14> * added proof of concept filter to remove certain .a files from the 18:48 < CIA-14> livecd (space optimization) 18:48 < karasz> like making a monolithic kernel does present speed advantages.. 18:48 < karasz> or not 18:48 < rxr> nope 18:50 < karasz> so it is just against loadable kernel module based attacks? 18:55 < rxr> yeah - maybe - but if you have root / CAP_... rights you can inject code in other ways - e.g. via /dev/mem ,-) 18:55 < mnemoc> rehi 18:55 < rxr> hi mnemoc 18:55 < rxr> I hope you like my livecd/pkgsel and the associated pkgsel_parse rewrite ... 18:55 < rxr> mail to the list in some seconds ... 18:56 < karasz> hi mnemoc 18:56 < karasz> and then rxr what are the advantages of monolith? 18:58 < _Ragnar_> karasz: most scriptkiddies won't know how to patch /dev/mem tho ... and if you compile a custom kernel, chance of something going wrong with that are higher, so it's still worth to take the easy way away from the scriptkiddies 18:58 < mnemoc> rxr: i really don't like 13226 18:58 < mnemoc> moin rxr, karasz, _Ragnar_ 18:58 < rxr> mnemoc: why ? 18:58 < mnemoc> categories thing 18:59 < rxr> mnemoc: do you use it ? 18:59 < _Ragnar_> moin 18:59 < rxr> aside that our categories stink and I still wait for your proposal how to improve them ,-) 18:59 < mnemoc> rxr: not because because current categorization sucks 18:59 < mnemoc> rxr: not now because current categorization sucks 18:59 < mnemoc> but we have to solve that 19:00 < mnemoc> and pkgsel shall supoort them 19:00 < rxr> mnemoc: ok but I strongly suggest an alternative keyword 19:00 < mnemoc> no need 19:00 < rxr> since it will always suck when you want base/* and get random category selections mixed in 19:00 < rxr> s/keyword/syntax/ ... 19:00 < mnemoc> we have four things 19:00 < mnemoc> packages, repos, categories and flags 19:01 < rxr> e.g. [XO=-] category/.... 19:01 < rxr> yes - just prefix what namespace you want when it is not repository/package ,-) 19:01 < rxr> I hope you find my = useful ... 19:01 < mnemoc> if token ends with / is a repo 19:01 < mnemoc> base/ 19:01 < rxr> well - right now you need base/* though ... 19:02 < mnemoc> why * ?? 19:02 < rxr> just so ... 19:02 < mnemoc> listen please :) 19:02 < rxr> one can use multimedia/lib* 19:02 < rxr> ok - I listen ,-) 19:03 < mnemoc> let's do things simple 19:03 < mnemoc> if token ens with / it's a repo 19:03 < mnemoc> if not, it can be anything except a repo 19:03 < mnemoc> with * expanding to [^ ]* 19:04 < mnemoc> if you want multimedia libs, lets do a category for them 19:04 < mnemoc> multimedia/* <--- all multimedia categories 19:04 < mnemoc> multimedia/libs <--- all multimedia libraries 19:04 < mnemoc> as categories 19:05 < mnemoc> desktop/* desktop/kde/* desktop/*/core 19:05 < mnemoc> categories 19:05 < mnemoc> perl* <--- package 19:05 < mnemoc> perl/ <--- repo 19:06 < rxr> I would not limit the selections to a repo only repo/lib* should be fine 19:06 < mnemoc> not all libs start with lib 19:06 < mnemoc> don't limit it 19:06 < rxr> I also would not match anything if it has no slash - imagine "rc" it might match a lot of stuff aside the "rc" shell you want 19:07 < rxr> mnemoc: if you want a category you can still write category/multimeda/lib if that is what you want 19:07 < mnemoc> ' $pattern ' 19:07 < mnemoc> not '$patern' 19:07 < rxr> the inexactness of the pkgsel_parse of t-1h is exactly what made my afternoon a pain ... 19:08 < rxr> when I write "rc" I want rc - and not anything that is accidently in the way ... 19:08 < mnemoc> you are mapping pkgsel you your ugly sed matches which are intrinsicly wrong because you depend on repo or package name 19:09 < mnemoc> ' rc ' will only match rc 19:09 < CIA-14> rene * r13231 /trunk/package/filesystem/devfsd/ (devfsd.desc devfsd.init): 19:09 < CIA-14> * do not build devfsd by default anymore and do not enable it during 19:09 < CIA-14> bootup automatically 19:09 < mnemoc> multimedia/lib* will put libidibum which is not a library on you package selection 19:10 < rxr> ok - we are only talking about a minor syntactic detail what to match ... 19:10 < mnemoc> (just a sample) 19:10 < rxr> we can decide that when we have useful categories ... 19:10 < mnemoc> it's not minor because you changed how repositories are matched 19:10 < rxr> mnemoc: ok - but audio/*jack* is valid, no? 19:10 < rxr> unless you want a jack category ,-) 19:10 < mnemoc> *jack* 19:10 < mnemoc> why audio? 19:11 < rxr> well - even jack, was just an example .. 19:11 < mnemoc> if a bunch of packages from a repo are needed together lets do a category for them 19:11 < rxr> mnemoc: let's decide in which tiny differing syntactic way to handle categories vs. repositories when we have sensible cats ... 19:12 < mnemoc> when we start using categories we will get categories 19:12 < mnemoc> you change was a big change 19:12 < mnemoc> your* 19:12 < rxr> mnemoc: do you really thing we want to maintain a set of to be maintained categories when one target just wants to select 5 programs it needs ... 19:12 < mnemoc> we can improve without changing current semantic 19:12 < mnemoc> if target wants the package, add the package explicitly 19:13 < rxr> a change was needed base/ would have matched base/ categories as well ... 19:13 < rxr> also do you see the need for the = ? 19:13 < mnemoc> if they are really tied, lets tie them 19:13 < mnemoc> i like ! 19:13 < mnemoc> what is = ? 19:13 < rxr> take the default state for that match 19:14 < rxr> mnemoc: read my mail on the list 19:14 < mnemoc> = reset to what .desc say? 19:15 < rxr> nope 19:15 < rxr> the Create-PkgList generated state of course 19:15 < rxr> that is per architecture mostly 19:16 < rxr> how do you want to select arch specific stuff in the pkgsel otherwise ? 19:16 < rxr> x86/ will enable x86 stuff on non x86 arches ... 19:19 < rxr> which is of course also what .desc says for non arch packages ... 19:19 < mnemoc> the whole repo, or using categorization, or always explicit, or by flag.... so finally they will be disabled due to arch restrictions on .desc 19:20 < rxr> ? 19:20 < rxr> they will not be disabled later on 19:20 < rxr> since arch restrctions comes first and then it goes thru the pkgsel ... 19:20 < mnemoc> X x86/ will add all x86, but if it's for ppc they wont exist 19:20 < rxr> ?? 19:20 < rxr> sure they exist as = and X x86/ turned them on ... 19:20 < rxr> (and still turns) 19:21 < rxr> just that you use = x86/ now ... 19:21 < mnemoc> if arch = sparc, x86/ packages will never be on packages file because Create-PkgList will ignore them 19:22 < rxr> oh - you are right, did not noticed that ,-) 19:22 < rxr> but still - it honors .desc 19:22 < mnemoc> so X BOOT is enough 19:22 < mnemoc> on generation 19:22 < mnemoc> after that you should only loop over 'config/$config/packages' 19:23 < mnemoc> i don't see the point for '=' 19:24 < rxr> i see it ,-) don't use it then ,-) 19:24 < mnemoc> for foo-% we will need a macro (to add new lines on packages files)... i was thinking in '+' as oposite of '-' 19:25 < mnemoc> good :) 19:26 < mnemoc> but on patterns i think all we need is 'repo/' whole repo, and if don't end with / match any field except the repo 19:27 < mnemoc> and categories can do the rest 19:27 < mnemoc> pakcage name is not under our control 19:27 < mnemoc> repositories are only one so too much stuff enters on them 19:28 < mnemoc> so the only thing we can really contorl is categorization 19:28 < mnemoc> desktop/kde/office 19:28 < mnemoc> desktop/kde/* 19:29 < mnemoc> desktop/*/core 19:29 < mnemoc> games/rpg 19:29 < mnemoc> lets see what categories do we need for our current targets 19:30 < mnemoc> minimal, minimal-xorg, minimal-desktop, desktop, livecd, archivista 19:30 < mnemoc> explicit pkgsel is bad because it miss new deps 19:31 < rxr> yeah - that is another thing 19:31 < mnemoc> repo or package name matching is bad because miss relocations and add new packages which noone expected to be added 19:31 < mnemoc> so we have to maintain categories 19:31 < rxr> let's not put too much more work on it - because in 2.3 or so I want to select by edges of the dep graph 19:31 < rxr> like X koffice ooo xterm (or so) and have all selected that is needed to build it ... 19:31 < mnemoc> O packages wont ever be on your dep graph 19:32 < rxr> just eleminating most of current pkgsel .. 19:32 < mnemoc> to do that we need to discriminate between 'levels' of dependency 19:32 < rxr> mnemoc: those can still be added using the other mechanims we have now and talked about 19:32 < mnemoc> X vim adding X? 19:32 < mnemoc> xorg* 19:33 < rxr> X vim does only added libs and proto packages required to build vim 19:33 < mnemoc> auto-deps yes, but only the minimal set 19:33 < rxr> if you want a text only write O xorg/ at the bottom, no? 19:33 < rxr> yeah - or the other way round ... 19:34 < mnemoc> but autodeps is a whole new field :) 19:34 < mnemoc> i was discussing against pkgsel semantic :p 19:34 < mnemoc> the change on pkgsel semantic* 19:35 < mnemoc> i thinkg mixing repo/pkg is harmfull and unnecesary 19:36 < mnemoc> repo and package names are almost an accident, and shall be avoided as much as posible on sematic processing 19:37 < rxr> mnemoc: why it is harmful - when I want and find this useful: multimedia/lib* why you want me to stop using it ? 19:37 < mnemoc> because that should be used for categories 19:37 < rxr> I wasted a lot of hours on the first category reorganization in ROCK times 19:37 < rxr> I'll never do this again 19:37 < rxr> and until someone rewrites all categories to be useful I want to select packages this way 19:38 < mnemoc> mnemosyne depend on pkgsels, i use lot of pkgsel 'bricks' if semantic changes i would have to fork it 19:38 < rxr> mnemoc: can you look at livecd/pkgsel and rewrite it the way it should be and produce the same package files as it does right now ? 19:38 < rxr> mnemoc: did you use stuff that is no longer working ? 19:38 < rxr> s/did/do/ 19:38 < rxr> do yo uselect on category ? 19:38 < mnemoc> what stuff? 19:39 < rxr> stuff that worked t-2h ago and I removed ? 19:39 < mnemoc> phone 19:40 < rxr> ok /me swimming hall 19:41 < rxr> back on the terminal in 2h or so ... 19:42 < mnemoc> re 19:43 < mnemoc> i have been jumping around the whole day 19:43 < mnemoc> i ahven't touched anything 19:43 < mnemoc> i think multimedia/lib* is harmfull because makes imposible to match categories in any future 19:44 < rxr> category/foo/bar 19:44 < rxr> mnemoc: did my changes broke any of your pkgsel rules ? 19:45 < mnemoc> i haven't touch my repos since ooo update.... two days ago 19:45 < rxr> well - ok 19:45 < rxr> i take a look at your current rules 19:45 * rxr really gone now 19:45 < rxr> cu 19:45 < mnemoc> that's not the point 19:45 < mnemoc> ok, cu rxr 19:46 < karasz> have fun rxr 19:46 < mnemoc> i have only explict packages now 19:46 < mnemoc> but a feature that makes imposible a grow we must have, it's a damange and not a feature, even if it's conformatable today 19:56 < karasz> for an athlon xp what iso is recomended pmmx? 20:02 < mnemoc> yes 20:03 < madtux> sparc64 20:04 * madtux hides 20:13 * karasz finds madtux :D 20:14 * mnemoc wonders what karasz does to madtux now 20:15 < madtux> lol 20:16 * sepp_ unhines and say hello 20:16 -!- sepp_ is now known as sepp 20:16 < sepp> unhides* 20:16 < madtux> hello unhided sepp 20:17 < mnemoc> watch out, karasz is free 20:17 < sepp> :D 20:17 < sepp> its trapping time? 20:18 < mnemoc> karasz just did very nasty things to poor madtux 20:18 < madtux> 0_o 20:18 < mnemoc> look at his poor face now :( 20:18 < madtux> mnemoc, you sick little BOFH 20:18 < madtux> :) 20:18 < mnemoc> i'm not a bofh 20:19 < mnemoc> i'm just a poor coder 20:19 < madtux> BCFH then 20:19 < mnemoc> :) 20:23 < karasz> mnemoc you ruin my reputation... :) 20:23 < mnemoc> :) 20:23 * karasz thinks `oh wait I didn't have one in the first place!?` 20:24 < valentin> re 20:24 < mnemoc> madtux is a cute teddy boy :) that wont ruin your reputation 20:24 < madtux> karasz, don't mind... he did not know that.. so have fun making him feel guilty 20:24 < mnemoc> :) 20:24 < madtux> teddy boy??! OMG. 20:24 < karasz> nah i'm not that kind :) 20:24 < madtux> valentin, hello. 20:25 < mnemoc> yellow, blue, brown.... brown is ground right? 20:25 < karasz> mnemoc do not play with electric stuff 20:25 < karasz> we still need you :) 20:27 * mnemoc has nothing to test except his tonge :\ 20:27 < karasz> 0_0 20:28 * karasz fingers crossed ;) 20:28 < karasz> mnemoc are you still there? 20:28 < mnemoc> yes, i have done thing yet 20:28 < karasz> god 20:29 < karasz> you really scared me 20:29 < mnemoc> just cuting cables with a knife 20:29 < karasz> testing sharpness with your tongue? 20:29 < mnemoc> nah ;) 20:29 < karasz> ;) 20:30 < karasz> damn my net is slow... :( 20:30 < madtux> well mnemoc your tongue is not needed for coding its alright to test the knife's sharpness with rather than ur fingers 20:34 < mnemoc> the yellow is ground 20:38 < valentin> mnemoc: did you succed in recovering some documents ? 20:38 < mnemoc> just a few 20:38 < valentin> :( 20:39 < mnemoc> "shit happens" 20:41 < mnemoc> weirdly i recovered subdirs, but not documents at the root of my mistake 20:49 < valentin> huh - which hash is beeing used for /etc/passwd passwords ? 20:50 < mnemoc> crypto :p 20:50 < mnemoc> crypt* 20:50 < mnemoc> + fixed 'salt' 20:51 < valentin> i just found out that my university account only uses the first 8 letters of my passwd and ignores appended stuff 20:51 < _Ragnar_> fixed salt? that kinda defeats the purpose 20:53 < mnemoc> valentin: i think it's more like login/passwd cutting it, that encription only considering first 8 20:54 < valentin> damn - and i wasted my time typing all 10 for two years now... 21:50 -!- jsaw [n=jsaw@volans.mpimf-heidelberg.mpg.de] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 21:51 -!- jsaw [n=jsaw@volans.mpimf-heidelberg.mpg.de] has joined #t2 21:54 < rxr> re 21:54 < rxr> md5 21:55 < mnemoc> :) 21:55 < rxr> md5 on modern systems 21:55 < rxr> in rock since 199x ... 21:56 < mnemoc> even without shadow? 21:57 < rxr> mnemoc: with pam it depends what back end it is anyway ... 21:57 < mnemoc> i think that's not valentin's case :) 21:58 < mnemoc> password trimmed to 8 chars 22:00 < mnemoc> rxr: did you try to build ooo? 22:00 < mnemoc> i'm not sure if it builds for gcc4 22:01 < mnemoc> java part builds with java 1.4 but not 1.5 due to 'strictness' issues 22:01 < rxr> mnemoc: not yet 22:02 < rxr> I wanted to build ooo when the rest of the livecd is streamlined 22:02 < rxr> sun is great 22:02 < mnemoc> i love sun almost as much as microsoft 22:03 < MisterN> who needs java in ooo? i thought it was needed for the database stuff only :D 22:03 < mnemoc> help needs java 22:04 < MisterN> *checks* 22:04 < rxr> mnemoc: even the hlpe ? 22:04 < MisterN> nah help runs fine with java disabled 22:05 < mnemoc> at least xmlhelp module needs java and bdb :p 22:05 < mnemoc> i don't use ooo 22:06 < rxr> MisterN: dit you built from source ? 22:06 < rxr> did even 22:06 < mnemoc> MisterN: are you using t2's ? 22:06 < MisterN> no from binary :) 22:06 < MisterN> and i have no t2 thingy 22:06 < MisterN> :) 22:06 < mnemoc> most ooo deps are only at build time 22:06 < MisterN> oh ok 22:07 < rxr> MisterN: you run Gentoo right 22:07 < rxr> ? even 22:07 < MisterN> rxr: yes i do 22:07 < rxr> and you Emerged ooo-binary or what it is named ? 22:07 < MisterN> openoffice-bin 22:08 < MisterN> yes 22:08 < mnemoc> built on their farm or by sun/ximian? 22:08 < MisterN> by sun/ximian 22:09 < mnemoc> do they have ooo as source package? 22:09 < MisterN> yes 22:09 < MisterN> but not for my platform 22:10 < MisterN> (the -bin is not for my platform, either :D) 22:10 < mnemoc> which? 22:10 < CIA-14> rene * r13232 /trunk/target/archivista/rootfs/home/archivista/install.sh: 22:10 < CIA-14> * fixed archivista/install.sh for the case where no update is possible 22:10 < CIA-14> by initializing a variable and added som quoting to debug output for 22:10 < CIA-14> easier communication with customers on the phone ... 22:11 < MisterN> my platform: amd64 22:12 < mnemoc> rxr: is noisy running continues now? 22:15 * mnemoc just notice rene is using my 'mnemoc' screen at noisy :p 22:19 < mnemoc> rxr: http://t2.geeks.cl/regressions/stable/ 22:37 < rxr> mnemoc: misl said so 22:37 < rxr> mnemoc: ? 22:37 < rxr> mnemoc: nope - I never touched your screen there ... 22:38 < rxr> mnemoc: do you sell a tape to that company now? 22:38 * rxr dinner 22:40 < mnemoc> rxr: i'll have to prepare a bacula facility :) 22:41 * mnemoc to pick up his girls 22:41 < mnemoc> back in 1h 22:59 < MisterN> n8 22:59 -!- MisterN [n=MrN@p549CF8A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["Wieso gibt es keine guten Quitmessages? Jaja, diese ist auch doof."] 23:06 < rxr> mnemoc: have you mailed mr. archivista sss 23:06 < rxr> ? even 23:06 < rxr> n8 - cu early 23:26 < karasz> mnemoc around? 23:26 < madtux> he is away for a little.. he should be back shortly 23:26 < karasz> i just noticed that... 23:27 < madtux> karasz, even though, if you need help, perhaps i can be helpful ? 23:27 < karasz> thanks for the offering but i just wanted to talk to him abt postgresql 8.1 being released 23:28 < karasz> he is the mantainer of postgresql package, isn't he? 23:29 < madtux> u just need to ask the .desc file :) 23:30 < karasz> i can not check now but i think that now in T2 is 8.0.3 beta or some... 23:30 < madtux> let me see 23:30 < karasz> now 8.1 is released as "stable" 23:31 < madtux> current package is "Stable 8.0.4" 23:31 < karasz> 2.1.0? 23:31 < karasz> or trunk? 23:31 < madtux> trunk 23:32 < madtux> http://svn.exactcode.de/t2/trunk/package/database/postgresql/postgresql.desc 23:32 < karasz> my opinion is that trunk should have 8.1.0 and 2.1.0 should remain as is because is released 23:32 < karasz> but than again that is just my opinion... 23:33 < karasz> mnemoc should decide 23:34 < karasz> i meant that is mnemoc's decision (guess i am tired :( ) 23:34 < madtux> i agree with ur opinion about 2.1.0 ... unless mnemoc has made branch to keep 2.1.0 updated 23:34 < karasz> but trunk is not suposed to be bleeding edge? 23:35 < karasz> anyway at least the very last "stable" releases? 23:35 < madtux> but if u do not have write access to svn please feel free to send an update patch to the mailing list.. but please make sure to build and test the package before submiting the update 23:35 < karasz> i know, i know 23:35 < karasz> other that that mnemoc will rip my head off :) 23:36 < madtux> no... rene will :) 23:36 < karasz> and no i do not have svn write because i am not a developer 23:36 < karasz> i am just lingering around trying to learn something 23:37 < karasz> kinda' apprentice stuff 23:37 < madtux> well starting with update patches can be a good beginign to learn more about t2 internals.. and as well to start making a path to become a future developer 23:37 < madtux> :) 23:38 < madtux> i have write access, but i rather have u send the update patch so that u can learn about package structure and updates, and so that mnemoc gets to see it 23:38 < karasz> now i do not have a T2 machine... :( i had to make an urgent server for a customer 23:38 < madtux> i see. so what are u currently running? 23:38 < karasz> when i had such a machine i was a little more active, even added konversation to T2 23:39 < madtux> NOTE: if the answer is windows, please just say .. something useless for the matter 23:39 < karasz> which i am very proud of even if it is really nothing 23:39 < karasz> i didn't understood the last line... 23:40 < karasz> ??? 23:42 < karasz> am I lagging here? 23:42 * karasz wonders... 23:46 < karasz> hmmm my connection could't be that bad...myabe i scared madtux off? 23:47 < karasz> yes i am definitely tired 23:47 < karasz> my spelling is horrific 23:49 -!- morfoh [n=jeru@p54BEF712.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2 23:50 < morfoh> moin 23:50 < karasz> hehe moin morfoh 23:51 < morfoh> hehe moin karasz :) 23:51 < morfoh> karasz: still banging your head ? ;) 23:51 < karasz> nope 23:51 < madtux> rats in the channel i smell 23:51 < karasz> i have a very strong head an week walls here :D 23:52 < morfoh> madtux: I just smell a "pyromaniac" ;) 23:53 * karasz googles around for a smell enabled irc client ....0_0 23:54 < morfoh> madtux: but where is the guy who paints pigs ? :D 23:54 < madtux> haha 23:55 < morfoh> karasz: you'll need a special service provided by "hostarica" for the "smell-feature" 23:56 < morfoh> not to mention a ill brain :) 23:56 * morfoh hides 23:57 < morfoh> does somebody know the status of mnemoc's "adventure" to rescue the lost data ? --- Log closed Wed Nov 09 00:00:53 2005