--- Log opened Tue Apr 26 00:00:43 2005 00:03 < valentin> wasn't there a gcc stl extention for getline which returns a std::string instead of dumping the output into a char* buffer ? 00:05 < jeru> good night all 00:06 -!- jeru [~jeru@p54BFF69C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:06 < valentin> gn8 jeru 00:06 < valentin> hey... now he is gone :/ 00:34 < sepp> good night all 00:41 < valentin> gn8 sepp 01:41 < Mech> hey guys - anyone know where to find docs on the gnu system naming convention ? autoconf docs mention its 'cpu-vendor-os' but I thought it had more components ?? 01:42 < Mech> (or is 'gnu-linux' considered 1 component ? ) 01:50 < valentin> mech: i think so ... 01:51 < Mech> valentin: so if I build something with uclibc - Does that get put in there ? maybe i386-unknown-linux-uclibc ? 01:51 < valentin> yep 01:52 < Mech> ahh.. ok 01:52 < valentin> irc gnu stands for gnu libc 01:52 < valentin> it should be linux-gnu ? 01:52 < Mech> yeah - I got it backwards :-P 01:53 < Mech> when you add stuff to T2 - say heimdal support... 01:53 < valentin> mnemoc: are multiple search/nameserver entries allowed in one rocknet interface config ? 01:54 < Mech> which can be used in multiple packages, is it the responsiblity of the heimdal maintainer or the other package maintainers to update the 'extended' packages ? 01:57 < valentin> to be honest: in T2 maintainers are often silently ignored when it comes to updateing. Whoever sees an advantage/fix in some update, submits the patch. The maintainer is there to give feedback and he has the right to veto agains modifications in the package :) 01:58 < Mech> ahh thanks :-) 01:58 < valentin> mnemoc updates them all, anyway .... 01:59 < Mech> I'm having to build a 'mini-T2' for a project... 01:59 < valentin> what kind of project ? 01:59 < Mech> hopefully, after this, I can get back into T2 proper 01:59 < Mech> valentin: just a lil contract gig - not finalized yet, but I'm starting my background research/brainstorming/etc. 02:01 < Mech> two interesting differences with T2 will be database storage of build data, and a 'global configuration' step, where each package gets to look at the existing build parms and change them (for just itself, or globally) 02:01 < valentin> for an ip xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx, what are those xxx tripples called ? 02:02 < valentin> Mech: you can have the second point 02:03 < Mech> ?? 02:03 < valentin> the global configuration - many packages insert their config option into the config 02:16 < Mech> sorry - phone 02:16 < Mech> anyway, with this 'config stage' - actual code in each recipe could be executed to evaluate the existing build parms and modify them 02:17 < Mech> and the 'finished' build parms would be stored in a database for future use 02:18 < Mech> it would be a very small system - it only has to support 1 particular 'mini-distro' but I thought it might be good for playing/testing stuff 02:18 < valentin> by now you can script in the package .conf files or in the targets 02:18 < Mech> ahh - didn't realize that... so I guess the database would be the only real difference 02:20 < Mech> the database would have all the packages in build order, so you can just walk the db from start to finish and dispatch jobs. Should cut down on memory usage versus keeping the whole build graph in memory (like OpenEmbedded does - python sucks over 300M for a build) 02:25 < valentin> what is the "build graph" ? 02:26 < Mech> the dependency graph for building packages - "busybox depends on glibc or uclibc" 02:26 < valentin> that is not 300M 02:27 < Mech> valentin: It explodes out - and I don't think python is very memory effiecient :-P OE brings my lil 2.6GHz celeron to its knees! 02:27 < valentin> in theory, a graph has at most quadratic number of edges 02:28 < Mech> I build a 'base image' with like 400 packages - it took like 8 hours 02:28 < valentin> hm - i see no reason why the dependency graph should slow things up 02:28 < valentin> and what is the pure build time ? 02:29 < Mech> not sure about that - but OE builds a full cross toolchain from scratch at the start of ever build - so that undoubtbly added a chunk of time 02:29 < Mech> I'm actually working in Lua instead of python 02:30 < Mech> Lua offered the advantages of being small, fast, and very easy to integrate with 'C' code - so time critical portions could be re-written in pure 'C' later 02:30 < valentin> we considered using lua for our config system in future versions 02:31 < valentin> by now most of our scripts are bash and binutils based 02:32 < valentin> but there is never a memory usage of 300 MB 02:32 < valentin> no idea what OE does 02:33 < valentin> normaly you seldom need more than 1000 Variables and a douzend sub-processes 02:34 < valentin> maybe OE holds the configuration states for each package in global memory all the time 02:34 < valentin> in t2 the config is evaluated each time a package is build 02:34 < Mech> I believe it does - its based on portage... I get the impression it reads everything into memory, and keeps it there 02:38 < valentin> i did not take a closer look at OE - but it seems to aim for a similar task like t2, only that it is far from perfect 02:39 < Mech> valentin: its pretty interesting - they have about 2500 packages available. the entire process is 'data driven' - configs (re)define vars to control the build 02:39 < valentin> and the people over there seem to develop software, too 02:39 < valentin> Mech: that is what we do 02:39 < Mech> makes it very hard to figure out where settings are coming from 02:40 < Mech> valentin: T2 seems to be a lil 'clearer' then OE - easier to find stuff 02:40 < Mech> yeah - a lot of the OE guys do embedded dev. for a living 02:40 < Mech> also, a lot of the OE recipes are 'broken' for 'wierd' combinations (uclibc, odd processors, etc) 02:41 < Mech> I had to fight just to get a i386 boot image :-P 02:41 < valentin> i would not bet every combination of hw/targets is working in t2, but at least the desktop target is well tested 02:42 < valentin> and t2 is not restricted to 'embedded' 02:43 < valentin> only thing is: we missed the marketing during the years 02:43 < Mech> yeah - for something like this a 'build farm' is pretty much a requirement - you really need to be able to do continous builds with multiple variations to see whats broken :-( 02:43 < Mech> a big task :-( 02:43 < valentin> esp. gentoo is well known to the world. it's ebuild hell... 02:44 < valentin> Mech: we aim for a bigger user base instead of a compile farm 02:45 < valentin> it is very late now - i'd like to take a nap 02:45 < Mech> valentin: yeah - big and varied would allow excercising most of the options.. 02:45 < Mech> oh - g'nite :-) 02:45 < Mech> nice talking to you :-) 02:46 < valentin> have much fun - if there are questions, wait for someone to wake up or try our mailing list (hint:) 02:47 < valentin> cu 03:33 < mnemoc> re 03:42 < CIA-9> amery * r8525 /branches/2.1/package/powerpc/mol/ (pkg_linux24_post.conf pkg_linux24benh_post.conf): * merged 8520, fixed the mol postlinux conditionals to only build in stage > 1 03:50 < CIA-9> amery * r8526 /branches/2.1/package/scientific/comedi-driver/ (4 files): * merged 8521, fixed bug #6 - fixed comedi-driver postlinux to only build for stage >= 1 03:54 < CIA-9> amery * r8527 /branches/2.1/package/network/slmodem/ (6 files): * merged 8519, 8522, 8523 - fixed bug #7 - fixed slmodem to not install tools and not touch etc/modprobe.conf 04:03 < CIA-9> amery * r8528 /branches/2.1/package/network/slmodem/slmodem.desc: * reenabled slmodem, bug #7 is fixed and it doesn't show any problem further. 04:39 < Mech> has anyone played with AutoPackager ? 04:42 < mnemoc> not me 04:44 < Mech> mnemoc: http://autopackage.org/ 04:44 < Mech> could be interesting - I'm looking for something with a smaller footprint then .debs 04:44 < Mech> debs store tons of state on the filesystem :-( ipkg could be good too 04:45 < mnemoc> we just tarball the flist 04:47 < Mech> mnemoc: yeah - that would be the ultimate in low overhead. But I'd like some basic uninstall capability and the ability to download from a web repository 04:47 < mnemoc> we have uninstall capability :) 04:47 < mnemoc> even safe-update capabilities 04:49 < Mech> 'safe-update' ? 04:49 < mnemoc> update creates .new files for eveyr modified file 04:50 < Mech> ahh 04:51 < Mech> mnemoc: what is the disk overhead like? I assume you have to store some sort of db/list of whats installed to handle un-install ? 04:52 < mnemoc> var/adm/*/$pkg does the trick 04:52 < mnemoc> plain files but easy to compress 04:52 < mnemoc> flist is file list 04:52 < mnemoc> md5sum the original checkusm of every file 04:52 < mnemoc> we may lzo them in future 04:53 < Mech> so say, 100 bytes per file (full path + md5sum ) ? 04:54 < Mech> that would be umm 100K for 1000 files ( aside from rounding error :-P ) 04:54 < Mech> so 10K files per meg 04:54 < Mech> thats a lot better then the debian stuff 04:55 < Mech> is there support for un-install scripts ? 04:55 < mnemoc> let see linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> with all third-party modules ... (including nvidia and friends) 04:55 < mnemoc> # du var/adm/*/linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> 4 var/adm/cache/linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> 104 var/adm/cksums/linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> 12 var/adm/dep-debug/linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> 4 var/adm/dependencies/linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> 4 var/adm/descs/linux26 04:55 < mnemoc> 112 var/adm/flists/linux26 04:56 < mnemoc> 128 var/adm/md5sums/linux26 04:56 < mnemoc> 404 var/adm/olists/linux26 04:56 < mnemoc> 4 var/adm/packages/linux26 04:56 < mnemoc> flists, packages and md5sums are the only mandatory 04:58 < mnemoc> currently we have postinstall scripts.... but if postremove are needed they are not hard to add 04:58 < mnemoc> # wc -l var/adm/flists/linux26 04:58 < mnemoc> 1554 var/adm/flists/linux26 04:58 < mnemoc> linux26 has 1554 files 04:58 < Mech> and its 112 blocks - 66K ? 04:59 < Mech> err - 56K 04:59 < mnemoc> default du output is kilobyte afaik 05:00 < mnemoc> but those are plain text files.... highly compressables 05:01 < Mech> yeah - should get 4:1 easy on text 05:03 < mnemoc> but i think it's better to have var/adm mounted on a compressed filesystem instead of hacking var/adm compression 05:05 < Mech> I think ipkg actually skips the file list - I believe it can be setup to download the package and use that to control removing files 05:06 < Mech> interesting idea - saves in disk space, but you pay for it in network transfer 05:07 < Mech> I think the reasoning was you typically don't 'remove' software - your more likely to update it with a new version. So the file list from the new version can be used to remove the old version prior to update 05:08 < mnemoc> the file list of the new version say nothing about the old 05:08 < mnemoc> many package version their files 05:08 < Mech> yeah - or files may be added or removed. 05:09 < Mech> to be honest though - I haven't had a chance to play with ipkg yet. Just done a lil reading about it 05:09 < Mech> so I could be way off mark 05:09 < Mech> given that it was designed for stuff like ipaq's, I'm sure space will be a prime concern 05:11 -!- sepp [~sepp@p213.54.227.11.tisdip.tiscali.de] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 05:14 < mnemoc> sometimes, even when space (or speed) is the prime concern, people tend to design using bloat eyes 05:14 < mnemoc> simplicity is the best way to design for space or speed (imho) 05:17 < mnemoc> cramfs can do the rest (just an example) 05:27 < CIA-9> amery * r8529 /trunk/package/ (python/wxpython/wxpython.desc x11/wxwidgets/wxwidgets.desc): 05:27 < CIA-9> * updated wxwidgets (2.5.3.1 -> 2.5.5.1) 05:27 < CIA-9> * updated wxpython (2.5.3.1 -> 2.5.5.1) 06:15 -!- keinek_ [~Keinek@201.254.13.95] has joined #t2 06:24 -!- keinek [~Keinek@201.254.12.98] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 07:41 < rxr> re 07:42 < rxr> mnemoc: isn't 2.6 out ? 07:43 < mnemoc> not for wxpython 07:43 < mnemoc> and we use wxwidgets from wxpython 07:52 * mnemoc trying to build ghostscript with pdf_sec.ps injection disabled 07:52 < rxr> mnemoc: I can take a look into that totay 07:52 < rxr> today even 07:53 < mnemoc> i need to know if its a damn-weird side effect of a .ps, or ccache 07:54 < mnemoc> it failed 07:54 < rxr> mnemoc: I investigate in a minute, ok ? 07:54 < mnemoc> ok 07:54 < mnemoc> it's all yours 07:56 < rxr> maybe you could debug segfaulting binaries of cc-4.0.0 with -mcpu=ultrasparc ? 07:56 < rxr> just jokin ,-) 07:57 < mnemoc> no thanks :) 07:57 < rxr> ghostscript-8.15rc2 ? ?# 07:57 < mnemoc> yep 07:57 < rxr> well, ... 07:58 < mnemoc> the one which has been building for months 07:58 < rxr> okok 08:00 < mnemoc> weird... failed again with ccache disabled.... i'll file the issue and continue building 08:04 < rxr> mnemoc: please merge -^ ;-) 08:04 < CIA-9> rene * r8530 /trunk/package/develop/ccache/parse-config: * fixed chroot ccache directory creation 08:04 < mnemoc> ok 08:07 < CIA-9> amery * r8531 /branches/2.1/package/develop/ccache/parse-config: * merged 8530 - fixed chroot ccache directory creation 08:12 < rxr> hm - damn in debug.sh the loop mount is not done ?! 08:17 < rxr> | #define HAVE_MALLOC 0 08:17 < rxr> | #define malloc rpl_malloc 08:34 < rxr> mnemoc: with the above fixed gs builds 08:34 < rxr> I have to analyze why this happens ... 08:44 < rxr> damn - when I run it manually it does not happen :-( 08:47 < rxr> ah! 08:48 < rxr> the f*cking ghostsript configure crap thinks it is running in cross compilatation mode ... 08:48 < rxr> cross_compiling=maybe 08:48 < rxr> ??? what a assignment ... 08:48 < rxr> fazzy logic configure script ? *g* 08:49 < rxr> ah! there is the defect hiding ... 08:50 < rxr> 8429 amery var_append confopt "--with-drivers=ALL --with-x" 08:50 < rxr> it was you destroying it !!! 08:51 * rxr pulls mnemoc left ear 08:51 < rxr> mnemoc: test build running 08:51 < rxr> commit in some seconds 08:53 < rxr> == 08:52:37 =[5]=> Building graphic/ghostscript [8.15rc2 2.2.0-alpha]. 08:53 < rxr> -> Compiler Cache Hits while pkg build: 100.00% (611 hits, 0 misses) 08:53 < rxr> == 04/26/05 08:55:01 =[5]=> Finished building package ghostscript. 08:53 < CIA-9> rene * r8532 /trunk/package/graphic/ghostscript/ghostscript.conf: * fixed ghostscript misconfiguration, regression caused by r8429 08:58 < CIA-9> rene * r8533 /branches/2.1/package/graphic/ghostscript/ghostscript.conf: * merged r8532 from trunk: fixed ghostscript regression 09:29 < rxr> mnemoc: spamassassin also get's perl to segfault with a ccache-less rebuild perl ... 09:42 < rxr> and locally ... 10:04 < rxr> mnemoc: perl dumps core when run from within a perl script 10:07 < rxr> hm 10:07 < rxr> second 10:12 < rxr> oh - maybe FPIC ? 10:35 -!- _jeru [~jeru@mail.oberlinhaus.de] has joined #t2 10:35 -!- _jeru is now known as jeru 10:35 < jeru> moin 10:36 < rxr> moin 10:43 < rxr> hm - maybe perl segfault is linux kernel arg $0 program name handling ... 10:45 < rxr> hm - no 10:59 < rxr> hm - no idea about the perl problem ... 11:05 < jeru> rxr: is ccache default size of 1000MB ok ? 11:05 < rxr> yes 11:05 < rxr> please remeber it is per package ... 11:07 < rxr> hm - partly run gcc testsuite on the sparc 11:07 < rxr> === gcc Summary === 11:07 < rxr> # of expected passes 7583 11:07 < rxr> # of unexpected failures 5 11:07 < rxr> doesn't look too bad - and the unexpected are all timeouts as far as I have seen 11:11 < rxr> even with debugging symbols I do not get anything useful out of perl ... 11:11 < rxr> I leave it for now - too time wasting ... 11:47 < rxr> http://www.golem.de/0504/37720.html 11:55 < Mech> wow - 'distro build tools' keep turning up... 11:55 < Mech> http://www.gnnix.org/ 11:55 < Mech> I feel for this guy - I've been in pretty similiar situations :-) 11:55 < Mech> he seems to have a text mode installer thats real easy to work with too - 'locknload' 12:01 < rxr> hm - somehow gcc-4.0 is really not that solid on sparc ... :-((( 12:31 < valentin> moin 12:34 < valentin> $100.000.... that is quite much compared to the price of 40 minimal 3Ghz systems 12:39 < rxr> hehe 12:39 < rxr> moin valentin 12:46 < Mech> hmm - scratchbox is going to use GAR for its build stuff ( http://www.lnx-bbc.org/garchitecture.html ) 12:47 < Mech> It would be nice if everyone could decide on a 'standard' meta-data layout 12:47 < Mech> then T2, OE, Scratchbox, etc etc could share 1 meta data repo 12:48 < Mech> that would eliminate a _ton_ of redundant work 12:53 < rxr> valentin: what is your vote regarding how quickly we should try to adapt gcc-4.0 in 2.2 ? 12:54 < valentin> if the result is somehow stable (does not seem to be like that for sparc) i vote for quick adaption 12:55 < rxr> well - some stuff builds and runs fine on sparc 12:55 < rxr> e.g. even including vectorization ... 12:55 < rxr> but so far curl segfaults and bash does get a SIGBUS on startup ... 12:55 < valentin> how strict is 4.0 compared to 3.x ? that is, how many patches do we need for sources ? 12:55 < rxr> but only when ultrasparc optimizatoin are applied, e.g. not with v7 ... 12:56 < rxr> well - I just start a build - I expect a few packages to be patched 12:56 < rxr> some ugly historic extensions disapeared ... 12:56 < rxr> maybe I can hand out numbers soon 12:56 < rxr> btw. maybe the sparc problem is due to the old base system 12:56 < rxr> like glibc from stone age ... 12:57 < rxr> I try to start a system build there as soon as the athlon manages to produce a base system 12:59 < mtr_> hi rxr, valentin 13:00 < mtr_> do you have already fixed the glibc issues with gcc 4? "Please note that version 2.3.5 cannot be compiled using GCC 4": http://sources.redhat.com/ml/libc-announce/2005/msg00001.html 13:05 < rxr> well - it gets quite ugly right now anyway 13:05 < rxr> I'll delay this work even more ... 13:05 < rxr> for the log: 13:05 < rxr> D gcc-3.4.3-linkonce-1.patch 13:05 < rxr> D no-ld-error.patch 13:05 < rxr> D 3.4.3.patch 13:05 < rxr> D gcc-300-force-visibility.patch 13:05 < rxr> D 3.4.3-amd64.patch 13:05 < rxr> D no-install-zlib.patch 13:05 < valentin> with all the hype around 4.0 i expect upstream patches for such stuff soon 13:06 < rxr> with all the redhat'idi in glibc, i expect a public gcc-4 friendly glibc in about 2 years 13:07 < mtr_> ;-) 13:07 < CIA-9> rene * r8534 /trunk/package/base/gcc/apply-protector.sh: * "fixed" gcc to work without a protector patch 13:07 < rxr> M fixincl.patch 13:08 < mtr_> McGrath announced glibc 2.3.6 to appear soon, whatever this means 13:09 < valentin> if our transition to 2.2 takes as long as it did from 2.0 to 2.1 we have those two years ,) 13:12 < rxr> mtr_: there also where tags without a source tarball for over one year ... 13:32 < valentin> they are working with an air hammer outside. hope vibrations will not kill my server's harddrives... 13:34 < rxr> .oO 14:06 -!- mtr [~michael@Ha624.h.pppool.de] has joined #t2 14:24 -!- mtr_ [~michael@H912e.h.pppool.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:57 < CIA-9> rene * r8535 /trunk/package/base/ (glibc/glibc.desc glibc32/glibc32.desc): 14:57 < CIA-9> * updated glibc (2.3.4 -> 2.3.5) 14:57 < CIA-9> * updated glibc32 (2.3.4 -> 2.3.5) 15:00 < rxr> we need a new config system - not only is it destructive, it is also dog slow ... 15:06 < Mech> nite guys :-) 15:06 < rxr> cu Mech 15:06 < Mech> well, actually its morning here - but I'm nocturnal :-P 15:06 < Mech> bye rxr :-) 15:06 -!- Mech [~chatzilla@dsl081-073-058.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit ["Chatzilla 0.9.66 [Mozilla rv:1.7.3/20041001]"] 15:09 < jeru> ok ... have to move too ... cu later 15:11 -!- jeru [~jeru@mail.oberlinhaus.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:24 -!- tilix [~ilia@212.116.139.141] has joined #t2 15:28 -!- tilix [~ilia@212.116.139.141] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:40 -!- rxr_ [~rene@e178182199.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2 16:40 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.0-beta4 RELEASED | The next generation of System Development Environments (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ 16:40 -!- Topic set by menomc [] [Sat Apr 16 00:33:34 2005] 16:40 [Users #t2] 16:40 [ _Ragnar_] [ mnemoc] [ nzg] [ rxr_ ] [ valentin] 16:40 [ CIA-9 ] [ mtr ] [ rxr] [ sparc-kly] 16:40 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 9 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 9 normal] 16:40 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 21:15:33 2004 16:40 -!- [freenode-info] help freenode weed out clonebots, please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup 16:41 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 11 secs 16:53 -!- _jeru [~jeru@p54BFBC79.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2 16:53 < _jeru> re hi 16:54 -!- rxr [~rene@e178139069.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:57 -!- keinek_ [~Keinek@201.254.13.91] has joined #t2 16:58 -!- keinek [~Keinek@201.254.13.91] has joined #t2 16:59 < keinek> hi 16:59 < _jeru> hi keinek 16:59 < keinek> where is that keinek_? 17:00 < keinek> i was all night offline 17:00 < keinek> :/ 17:00 < _jeru> this was displayed before you joined -> 17:00 < _jeru> keinek_ (~Keinek@201.254.13.91) has joined channel #t2 17:00 < _jeru> keinek (~Keinek@201.254.13.91) has joined channel #t2 17:43 < mnemoc> hi 17:43 < _jeru> hi mnemoc :) 17:44 < mnemoc> rxr_: my line felt again while we were talking :( 17:44 < mnemoc> hi _jeru 17:44 < _jeru> mnemoc: voip ? 17:45 < mnemoc> i don't have audio here :\ 17:45 < mnemoc> talking=irc :) 17:45 < rxr_> mnemoc: no problem 17:45 < rxr_> ghostscript is fixed 17:45 < rxr_> but I stopped investigating Perl 17:45 < rxr_> no idea ... 17:45 < rxr_> it crashes executing some variabler content (./configure.pl or so) 17:46 -!- You're now known as rxr 17:46 < rxr> I think it is not too urgent 17:46 < rxr> let's rest it some days ... if you have not time to track that ugly thing ... 17:46 < rxr> mnemoc: maybe we should test out voip some day 17:46 < rxr> could be a nice "communication device" ,-) 17:46 < mnemoc> rxr: i only changed that (ghostscript) for confopt="$confopt .." to var_append... nothing else 17:47 < rxr> you forgot the " " seperator ;-) 17:47 < _jeru> rxr: I have some pending packages in my working copy for voip services ;) 17:47 < mnemoc> rxr: oh 17:47 < rxr> that --build=i386-bla-blus--the 17:47 < rxr> that --build=i386-bla-blus--with-drivers=all or so .. 17:47 < mnemoc> damn 17:47 < rxr> and thus did not build all drivers and made ghostscript think it is cross copiling 17:47 < rxr> since host != build .... 17:48 < rxr> was fun tracking 17:48 < rxr> however perl is not fun ... if anyone is interested ... ,-) 17:55 < mnemoc> no thanks :) 17:57 < rxr> too bad 17:58 < mnemoc> _jeru: when will www2 be back? i want to clock ghostscript bug 17:58 < mnemoc> _jeru: s/clock/close/ 17:58 < mnemoc> .oO( that was a weird typo )o 17:59 < _jeru> mom 18:01 < _jeru> mnemoc: tracker is back ... but still the weird behavior (no nav for tracker atm) ... I will write a small static portlet to "simulate" the menu. 18:01 < mnemoc> _jeru: thnkas :) add thing commands on URL is 'unconfortable' 18:02 < mnemoc> s/thing// 18:02 < _jeru> mnemoc: ack 18:02 < mnemoc> 503 Service Unavailable 18:02 < _jeru> https:// ? 18:03 < mnemoc> oops 18:03 < _jeru> mnemoc: you thought it was offline ? 18:03 < mnemoc> yep 18:03 < mnemoc> [034] - Live Kernel Configuration Panel 0.2.1 ?? 18:04 < _jeru> mnemoc: and we lost the state of the tracker issues due to our copying 18:05 < mnemoc> _jeru: it's databases gets corrupted very easily.... followup counter is always out of sync, and i have to reindex every time 18:06 < _jeru> hmmm ... damn 18:06 < mnemoc> i'll add a follow up to 11 now 18:08 < mnemoc> http://trasto.hopto.org/~wipeout/penguin.pdf 18:08 < keinek_> ups... i have two x-chat open 18:08 -!- keinek_ [~Keinek@201.254.13.91] has quit ["Abandonando"] 18:08 < keinek> i am a stupid. 18:08 < mnemoc> *G* 18:08 < keinek> :D 18:08 < mnemoc> ack 18:18 < valentin> hi mnemoc 18:18 < mnemoc> hi valentin 18:18 < _jeru> hi valentin 18:18 < valentin> i have tasty grapes from chile here 18:18 < mnemoc> :D 18:18 < mnemoc> EU removed the over fees imposed over chilean salmon yesterday 18:19 < valentin> nice - after ruining all chilean salmon-farmers ? 18:20 < mnemoc> they were close 18:24 < CIA-9> amery * r8536 /trunk/package/graphic/ghostscript/ghostscript.desc: * updated ghostscript (8.15rc2 -> 8.15rc3) 18:25 < mnemoc> does norway belong to EU? 18:25 < mnemoc> s/belong to/is part of/ 18:25 < mnemoc> .oO( member? what's the proper word? )o 18:26 < valentin> i would say member, but i am not sure 18:27 < valentin> and no, norway does not belong 18:27 < mnemoc> norway has lot of money invested on salmon-farms here 18:28 < rxr> hehe 18:28 < rxr> #t2 the politicans and world trade channel 18:28 < valentin> mnemoc: 18:28 < valentin> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_union#Member_states_and_successive_enlargements 18:29 < valentin> rxr: what about my tea offer ? 18:29 < rxr> consuming tea this week over at you ? 18:29 < rxr> did you name a day ? 18:29 < valentin> mnemoc: so "member states" is the correct term 18:29 < valentin> rxr: end of week, see query 18:29 < rxr> oh 18:29 < valentin> pref. friday 18:29 * valentin -> noodles 18:29 < rxr> which query ... 18:30 < rxr> the last thing in query was on Apr 23 ... 18:30 < rxr> friday sound nice 18:30 < rxr> have to finish some work including the lingering gcc article first ... 18:32 < mnemoc> rxr: as far as we don't bash for free, i see no problem on discussing misc topics :) 18:32 < rxr> mnemoc: btw. glibc maintenance update into 2.1 ? 18:33 < mnemoc> rxr: let me finish this ref first :) 18:33 < mnemoc> rxr: file a merge or package request on the tracker :) 18:34 < mnemoc> rxr: i'll force us to use that damn tool 18:34 < rxr> why damn? why force ? 18:35 < mnemoc> because we are not used to use that kind of stuff 18:35 < mnemoc> when you merged ghostscript you didn't tell what bug was it related :) 18:46 < rxr> forgot that you filled a ticket for it ... 18:46 < mnemoc> rxr: what do you think about issue trackers? should we write some kind of policy? 18:52 < rxr> issue trackers - or the one we use ? 18:52 < mnemoc> both 18:53 < rxr> ouhm - if you have spare time - policies and ducuments are always welcome 18:54 < mnemoc> but i want to know your thoughts about those tools 18:56 -!- sparc-kly [~sparc@64.237.140.181] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 19:04 < rxr> ouhm 19:04 < rxr> so you want me to write a paper so that you get an overview? 19:05 < valentin> rxr: you see my query ? 19:05 < rxr> ack 19:06 < valentin> :) 19:07 < mnemoc> rxr: nah... just some comments :) but if you want to sell an article about much better :) 19:19 < rxr> not really - I just wanted to know wath you expect me to do ,-) 19:20 < mnemoc> i want to hear you :) 19:23 < rxr> issue tracking is nice and a must 19:23 < rxr> if the plone thing scales I have no idea 19:24 < rxr> looked barely into ito 19:24 < rxr> how happy are you mnemoc and valentin with the plone site ? 19:26 -!- Cypl0dE [~mm@196-49-112.adsl.terra.cl] has joined #t2 19:26 < rxr> btw. I find the defaul font size a bit small 19:26 < rxr> hi Cypl0dE 19:27 < mnemoc> rxr: yep, i have to ctrl + every time :( 19:28 < rxr> my setups are often more sensible to this, since I usually drive my displays at a higer DPI 19:28 -!- Cypl0dE [~mm@196-49-112.adsl.terra.cl] has quit [Client Quit] 19:28 < mnemoc> i'm quite happy with plone thing as concept.... but the mess done to implement i18n is disturbing 19:29 < rxr> but when you also say this the font might indeed a bit tiny by default 19:29 < _jeru> rxr: I will increase it ;) 19:30 < mnemoc> _jeru: why manager has a home? 19:31 < _jeru> mnemoc: it's default 19:32 < rxr> I think we need at least a big design work to make the look attractive 19:32 < rxr> but I can take that part some time later 19:32 < rxr> (if necessary) 19:33 -!- Cypl0dE [~mm@196-49-112.adsl.terra.cl] has joined #t2 19:33 < _jeru> rxr: I'm preparing a nice skin already 19:33 < rxr> oh - cool 19:34 < mnemoc> but menu (portlets) problem is a bit more importand :) 19:34 < mnemoc> important* 19:34 < _jeru> mnemoc: ack 19:35 < rxr> i18n I guess 19:35 < rxr> of course functionality is important - I just worry to present T2 in a better light than the prevous preleminary site 19:35 < mnemoc> to get i18n working on navigation menu we had to update some core stuff 19:38 < rxr> right now I'm not too interested in the details ... 19:38 < mnemoc> :) 19:38 < rxr> mnemoc: you might consider pulling the gnome update into 2.1 19:38 < rxr> of course after your current ref build or so ... 19:38 < mnemoc> does it really build and work? 19:38 < mnemoc> i wanted to finish one ref before adding important rebuilds 19:45 < mnemoc> rxr: i think i'll remove wxpython24 19:45 -!- minto [~chatzilla@82-217-66-7.cable.quicknet.nl] has joined #t2 19:45 < minto> Hi all 19:46 < valentin> hi minto 19:46 < valentin> rxr: i like plone more than drupal from what i've seen so far 19:46 < minto> valentin: how is the father to be? And how is the mother? 19:46 < valentin> minto: thanks. good. 19:47 < valentin> how is your son ? 19:47 < minto> 18 months 19:48 < mnemoc> .oO( fahter to be.... uhm.... i wanted to name 2.1.0 as jsaw's daughter... what will i do with valentin's?? )o 19:48 < rxr> valentin: name 2.2 after her 19:48 < rxr> mnemoc: why remove wx24 ? 19:48 < valentin> what is with lars daughter ? *g* 19:48 < mnemoc> no wx24, wxpy24 19:49 < mnemoc> outch 19:49 < mnemoc> to many children :\ 19:49 < valentin> btw minto: you are the great exception. the only one with a son... 19:49 < mnemoc> to many women surounding T2 19:49 < rxr> then hand the names for 2.1.0, 2.1.1 and 2.1.2 ... 19:49 < rxr> when we have soo many *grrr* 19:49 < minto> :-) 19:50 < _Ragnar_> *lol* 19:50 < rxr> or just queue the names up when we will miss them later ... 19:50 < mnemoc> ok, and rene's for 2.2.0 19:50 < rxr> or we release major versions more quickly ... 19:50 < rxr> mnemoc: I doubt that 19:50 < mnemoc> _Ragnar_: can you add yourself to about/team ? 19:50 < mnemoc> rxr: let see :) 19:50 < valentin> rxr and susann are young and healthy, so.... 19:51 < mnemoc> "The T2 Generation" 19:51 < rxr> valentin: I and healthy ... 19:51 < minto> mnemoc: How can I test the swig .24 stuff? 19:51 < mnemoc> minto: svk? 19:52 < mnemoc> svk does extensive usage on SVN:: 19:52 < mnemoc> of* 19:52 < _Ragnar_> mnemoc: how? where? what?:) 19:52 < mnemoc> _Ragnar_: https://www2.t2-project.org 19:52 < minto> mnemoc: ack 19:52 < valentin> btw: why https ? 19:52 < mnemoc> register and edit ... i hope 19:52 < mnemoc> ask jeru :( 19:53 < rxr> oh my god - one of my C++ tests runs ten times slower with -Os than -O2 19:53 < mnemoc> pff 19:53 < rxr> and 15 times slower than -O2 -funroll-loops 19:54 < _Ragnar_> where do i register? 19:54 < rxr> well - I know why I changed the optmization default from Os to O2 19:54 < minto> mnemoc: We have not svk package in T2 19:54 < valentin> rxr: funrolls speed up this much ? 19:54 < rxr> valentin: I just bench 19:55 < rxr> I just do a openbench rerun with 3.4.3 and 4.0.0 with way better selected optimization comparision 19:55 < rxr> I can publish gzip and tramp3d soon 19:55 < rxr> the rest will run longer 19:55 < rxr> valentin: unroll-loops is not always that much faster 19:56 < mnemoc> minto: nope... svk is a bunch of around 40 perl packages 20:12 < _jeru> I've to do some maintenance on plone 20:12 < mnemoc> ok 20:12 < _jeru> thx :) 20:13 < valentin> what will be the future plan, i.e when to replace www by www2 ? 20:13 < rxr> suer 20:13 < rxr> when www2 is ready 20:13 < valentin> so we will start to migrate the missing content of www biger Christ kommt mir das Kotzen wenn ich die die derzeitige 20:13 < valentin> damn 20:14 < valentin> so we will start to migrate the missing content of www -> www2 soon ... 20:14 < rxr> was kotzt ... 20:14 < mnemoc> we need to solve menu problem and properly set the roles and permissions before open it 20:14 < valentin> what is about svn.exactcode ? 20:14 < rxr> what is about that ? 20:14 < valentin> rxr: someone on heise.de kotzt 20:14 < mnemoc> and @t2-project.org forwards :p 20:15 < rxr> valentin: ? 20:15 < rxr> mnemoc: you want a mail alias ? 20:15 < rxr> valentin: I thought we keep svn.exactcode.de 20:15 < mnemoc> exactcode.de is _the_ T2 sponsor 20:15 < rxr> no transition - no server work - keeping our already complex enough svn setup not too complex ... 20:15 < valentin> rxr: that was my question 20:16 < rxr> mnemoc: adding mail forwards is easy 20:16 < rxr> just currently I have no virtual domains set up in the jailed exim 20:16 < valentin> will the .org site stay at jeru's machine ? 20:16 < rxr> that is alejandro@t2-project.org would also work for alejandro@exactcode.de 20:16 < rxr> which is not what we want ... 20:16 < mnemoc> amery 20:16 < mnemoc> not alejandro please 20:16 < rxr> mnemoc: no problem ,-) 20:17 < rxr> I just wanted to point out that I need to majorly reconfigure our mail system for that 20:17 < rxr> and I have a spam update pending 20:17 < rxr> spamassassin and friends update of course ... 20:19 < valentin> rxr: what happens when you have dhcp and ip/gw keywords in your config ? you allways get dhcp ? 20:19 < rxr> that is unso 20:19 < rxr> unsupported and undefined 20:19 < rxr> you will get a mix 20:20 < rxr> I think DHCP first and ip/gw evaluation later on 20:20 < valentin> hm ... then i have to "erase" those lines from the config when the user clicks on dhcp 20:20 < mnemoc> but dhcp will overwrite ip/gw later 20:20 < mnemoc> do you plan to hardcode those restrictions or write some kind of schema? 20:21 < valentin> actually i just wanted to delete the address items from the config if you enable dhcp 20:21 < mnemoc> hardcoded 20:21 < valentin> only thing is: you loose your old config then 20:21 < mnemoc> what about dhcp, udhcp and dhcpcd ? 20:21 < rxr> mnemoc: valenting is talking about the gui frontend only I think 20:21 < valentin> mnemoc: for the fontend, yes 20:22 < valentin> rxr: well ... i planed to reuse the classes later for some more complex setup tools 20:22 < mnemoc> a plugable schema for validating options would be naice :) 20:22 < mnemoc> nice* 20:22 < rxr> btw eaier to read vectorization support matrix: 20:22 -!- Cypl0dE [~mm@196-49-112.adsl.terra.cl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:22 < rxr> valentin: yeah - Config++ would be welcome for 2.2 20:22 < rxr> Int Float 20:22 < rxr> 4 8 16 8 16 20:22 < rxr> Alpha: X 20:22 < rxr> ARM: X X X X X 20:22 < rxr> i386: X X X X X 20:22 < rxr> ia64: X X 20:22 < rxr> mips: X 20:22 < rxr> powerpc: X X X X 20:22 < rxr> supeh: X X X X X 20:22 < rxr> Sparc: X X 20:23 < rxr> damn - I guess with the unintended tabs it looks imperfect in your IRC clients ... 20:23 < valentin> rxr: please s/\t/ / or so 20:23 < rxr> valentin: it was xemacs - no tabs intended - damn beast ... 20:23 < valentin> mnemoc: elaborate on your scheme 20:24 < rxr> I guess he means some ruleset to define which combinations make sense 20:24 < rxr> or belong together 20:24 < valentin> is the user supposed to edit that rules ? 20:24 < mnemoc> valentin: xml does it to see what is valid and what is not 20:25 < mnemoc> valentin: we have mod_foo.sh for the procedures.... we may have some 'language' to define de usage and inject it together 20:25 < mnemoc> valentin: so you can validate the syntax and consistence of the config file without hardcoding anything 20:26 < rxr> .o(the network might get a totally different script language in 2.2 or later) 20:26 < rxr> the current bash code is too error prone and slow 20:26 < rxr> evaluating the profiles on my s 20:26 < rxr> 270Mhz UltraSPARC with just 7 or so interfaces takes over 3 (!!!) seconds 20:27 < rxr> I think this is not reasonable for such a tiny parsing work 20:27 < mnemoc> rxr: network 'engine' or config file? 20:27 < valentin> mnemoc: i am coding a config editor, not the rocknet self 20:27 < valentin> and in the config frontend, you have to do some hardcoding if you want clever grouped dialogs 20:28 < valentin> or you do it all the very generic way in some intermediate language like lua 20:28 < mnemoc> using schemas you don't need to 20:28 < valentin> mnemoc: ack, but for that first version that is too complicated. i want more or less simple classes now 20:29 < mnemoc> :) 20:29 < rxr> and s.th. working in some days 20:29 < valentin> and something with save undo 20:29 < mnemoc> but please, don't remove the posibility of migrating a machine from 2.1 to 2.2 20:30 < valentin> the config file formats should be mainly preserved - the tools not 20:30 < mnemoc> no problem 20:30 < rxr> I do not plan any config change for 2.2 20:31 < mnemoc> nice 20:33 < rxr> remember: release early release often 20:33 < rxr> avoid senseless config api or ui chanfes 20:33 < rxr> changes 20:34 < mnemoc> ACK 20:34 < valentin> rxr: config change is ? 20:34 < rxr> file format change 20:35 < valentin> rxr rather does such uncomplicated changes like updating glibc/gcc/... :) 20:36 < rxr> you just install a system with an updated gcc/glibc no hassle involved 20:36 < mnemoc> foo-% 20:36 < rxr> no idea yet 20:38 < rxr> aaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh 20:38 < rxr> my brother is bothering me with his gimp problems 20:39 < rxr> and now he went off the phone to the buzzing egg cooker ... :-(( 20:39 < mnemoc> tell him to install photoshop on osX :) 20:39 < rxr> brother comes from bothering - right? 20:39 < mnemoc> i think so 20:40 < valentin> what does the code keyword do ? 20:40 < rxr> code ?? 20:40 < mnemoc> source an script iirc 20:40 < valentin> public_code 20:40 < mnemoc> or run an script.... 20:40 < rxr> uh? 20:40 < mnemoc> minute 20:40 < rxr> no idea 20:41 -!- sparc-kly [~sparc@64.237.138.134] has joined #t2 20:41 < valentin> mnemoc: we have on_up/on_down ? 20:41 < mnemoc> yes, excute anything 20:42 < mnemoc> on_up/on_down ? 20:42 < mnemoc> there is run_up and run_down 20:43 < mnemoc> to execute anything on that action 20:43 < mnemoc> code is similar but you say when 20:43 < mnemoc> a hack 20:43 < valentin> ok 20:44 < valentin> i do not like hacks ... 20:44 < mnemoc> neither do i 20:44 < valentin> consider an ip address xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx/bits <- what is that bits part called ? 20:45 < valentin> we do not have a real subnet mask keyword, do we ? 20:45 < mnemoc> 8,16,24,32 usually 20:45 < mnemoc> no, only bits 20:45 < valentin> mnemoc: i know, but what it the name ? 20:45 < mnemoc> ip like bits 20:45 < rxr> the official name is in the t2 handbook 20:45 < mnemoc> iproute2 likes bits 20:46 < mnemoc> "netmask in bits" ? 20:46 < rxr> CIR CIF or whatever .. 20:46 < valentin> netmask-bits 20:46 < mnemoc> :) 20:46 < keinek> hey rxr 20:47 < keinek> mac os X is pretty? 20:47 < keinek> is easy? 20:47 < rxr> \item ip ip-address/netmask-bits 20:47 < rxr> 20:47 < rxr> Set the given ip {\bf and} netmask in CIDR notation (e.g. 192.168.5.1/24) 20:47 < rxr> hey - my memory is n 20:47 < rxr> ot too bad - CIDR it was ,-) 20:48 < keinek> good 20:48 < keinek> is easy if i know windows or linux for design? 20:48 < keinek> ex. adobe... 20:48 < keinek> is the same thing? 20:49 < valentin> keinek: what do you mean with easy ? 20:49 < valentin> easy to use / configure / develop applications ? 20:50 < mnemoc> develop drivers? :) 20:51 < rxr> osx stinks majorly 20:51 < rxr> welll - not as much as windows - but developing under linux is way mroe relaxing 20:51 < valentin> rxr: depends ... 20:51 < rxr> the only thing OS X is halfly good with is ht GUI 20:51 < valentin> yep 20:52 < rxr> and that only halfly ... 20:52 < valentin> i use linux on my apple if there is no special reason to boot into OSX - this should tell keinek all.... 20:52 < rxr> well - same here - of course ... 20:53 < rxr> and the special reason is only for money earning development purposes - not usability or need or so ... 20:54 < keinek> velentin easy is i come from linux or windows. 20:55 < keinek> velentin easy is if i come from linux or windows. 20:55 < rxr> some stuff is different and quite counter intutive ... 20:55 < rxr> ejecting disks by dragging the disk icon into the trash can and the like ... 20:55 < valentin> hehe 20:55 < rxr> also you have normally no right mouse button and use ctrl for all 20:56 < valentin> on the other hand i like the one-menu only concept 20:56 < rxr> and the cut'n paste is apple key rather than alt 20:56 < rxr> plus a lot of other pseudo intuitive things, that are not intuitive at all 20:56 < rxr> e.g. we had to read a lof of Interface Builder manuals to get some of the srange drag and drop 20:57 < rxr> concepts we never would have imagined ... 20:57 < keinek> ok.. in one week is like all day for use? 20:57 < rxr> of course it is graphical and colorful and when you got used to it it works ... 20:58 < keinek> :) 20:58 < keinek> is good know that 20:58 < rxr> for a lot of OS X bashing consult the t2 logs ... 20:58 < rxr> IRC logs 20:58 < valentin> keinek: if you need to choose between M$ or apple, please take apple 20:58 < rxr> http://dl.exactcode.de/irclogs/t2/ 20:58 < keinek> i asking because if someone tell me for work with that in a job, so i dont say "no" :) 20:58 < keinek> sure 20:58 < keinek> apple is more stable 20:59 < rxr> yes osx is one of the better platforms 20:59 < keinek> just for design 20:59 < valentin> at least 10.3 - forgot about 10.2 stability 20:59 < rxr> osx is also way more colorful and better to use 20:59 < rxr> way stricter human interface guidelines and applications than Windows has 21:00 < mnemoc> rxr: http://t2.geeks.cl/regressions/stable/regressions.html look this mm failing chain 21:02 < rxr> mnemoc: saw s.th. simillar over here 21:02 < mnemoc> there was any change on LD reciently? 21:02 < rxr> however I have no idea when this gnoem *mm stuff broke 21:02 < rxr> hm no 21:02 < rxr> or maybe - well 21:02 < mnemoc> my last reference didn't have this problem 21:02 < rxr> there is this visibility hidden gcc patch right? 21:03 < rxr> but that is older 21:03 < rxr> as is the optional -Wld,--as-needed thing - I hope you have not enabledf 21:03 < mnemoc> yes, older 21:03 < mnemoc> my config file is there :) 21:03 < mnemoc> i haven't enabled anything odd 21:03 < mnemoc> just extra pkgsel 21:04 < mnemoc> and xtrace 21:04 < rxr> export SDECFG_LD_AS_NEEDED='0' 21:04 < valentin> how many search/nameserver entrys can i have in one interface section ? 21:04 < rxr> glibc defines 3 in total 21:04 < rxr> 3 in /etc/resolve.conf 21:04 < rxr> but I have not looked at the code, if it really has a hardcoded array of 3 or so ... 21:04 < rxr> valentin: add two lines to the GUI 21:04 < rxr> primary and secondary nameserver entries are standard in GUIs ... 21:05 < valentin> and search ? 21:05 < mnemoc> valentin: do you really want to implement those restrictions? 21:05 < valentin> rxr: i need to handle any existing (valid) config file 21:05 < rxr> valentin: maybe search is not limited ... 21:05 < valentin> mnemoc: nope 21:05 < rxr> but only one keyword IIRC 21:05 < rxr> have not looked at the glibc parser for search, too 21:05 < mnemoc> i have two here 21:06 < rxr> hm - maybe list the first two in a text entry field and the others in a expert section as full, space sepearted list 21:09 < mnemoc> i think so 21:13 < rxr> valentin: does RTL in GCC for register transfer language - or for s.th. else ? 21:22 < rxr> I think the above ... 21:24 < mnemoc> wtf? gtk-sharp2 failed 21:24 < rxr> .oO 21:25 < rxr> RTL Representation Most of the work of the compiler is done on an intermediate representation called register transfer language 21:25 < rxr> ok - ack 21:26 < rxr> hey cool 21:26 < rxr> in tramp3d g++-4.0.0 was able to vectorize a loop instantiated by std::vector line 216 ,-) 21:29 < mnemoc> rxr: will you add my mirrors for 2.2.0-alpha? 21:31 < mnemoc> great sf.net is dead again 21:31 < valentin> rxr: stand ? 21:32 < valentin> ok 21:34 < rxr> valentin: stand what ? 21:35 < valentin> forget it 21:36 < rxr> you must not confuse me ... 21:36 < valentin> you did confuse me with your question 21:16 < rxr> valentin: does RTL in GCC for register transfer language - or for s.th. else ? 21:40 < rxr> glibc-2.3.5 still building for sparc32 21:40 < rxr> my "thesun" box is up right now if you feel the need to test s.th. on a sparc ... 21:41 < minto> mnemoc: is there another way to test swig stuff. Installing svk involves to much work. 21:41 < mnemoc> minto: no idea :( 21:42 < mnemoc> minto: but cpan should do it for you 21:42 * minto doesn't know how to use CPAN 21:43 < mnemoc> cpan 21:43 < mnemoc> install svk 21:43 < minto> Does T2 have a cpan package> 21:43 < minto> ? 21:44 < minto> Uhmm, part of perl 21:44 < mnemoc> :) 21:50 -!- jsaw [~jsaw@volans.mpimf-heidelberg.mpg.de] has joined #t2 21:55 < rxr> hi jsaw 21:59 < mnemoc> hi jsaw 22:04 < CIA-9> amery * r8537 /trunk/package/gnome2/gtk-sharp2/ (gtk-sharp2.conf gtk-sharp2.desc): * updated gtk-sharp2 (r41822 -> 1.9.3) 22:09 < CIA-9> amery * r8538 /branches/2.1/package/gnome2/gtk-sharp2/ (gtk-sharp2.conf gtk-sharp2.desc): * merged 8537 from trunk - updated gtk-sharp2 (r41822 -> 1.9.3) 22:09 < rxr> mnemoc: does it build ?= 22:10 < rxr> http://exactcode.de/rene/hidden/gcc-article/2005-gcc-4.0/ 22:10 < rxr> http://exactcode.de/rene/hidden/gcc-article/2005-gcc-4.0/stat2-rt.png 22:10 < rxr> Os is very bad with C++ and 4.0.0 22:10 < rxr> I guess not much inlining of the heavy tempalte code happening 22:10 < mnemoc> rxr: yes 22:11 < rxr> lu == -funroll-loops 22:11 < mnemoc> rxr: r41822 was failing on aclocal (wth?) but 1.9.3 is from april 12 and builds 22:11 < rxr> ofp == -fommit-frame-pointer 22:11 < rxr> -vect == vectorization applied 22:12 < rxr> as you can see 4.0 tempalte based C++ code can get twice as fast as with the already good 3.4.3 ... ! 22:12 < mnemoc> your 'hidden' is now known by google monster 22:12 < rxr> but hidden does not index the dir 22:13 < rxr> that is the hidden subparts stay hidden ... 22:13 < mnemoc> ic 22:13 < mnemoc> what do you use for graphics? 22:15 < rxr> ploticus 22:15 < rxr> wow - -funit-at-a-time can also give a speedup ... 22:15 < rxr> uaat not yet in the graphic 22:27 < jsaw> hi guys 22:28 < rxr> hey jsaw ! 22:28 < jsaw> hi rxr 22:29 < jsaw> have to leave again, going home, cu later 22:49 < jsaw> back home :) 22:52 < valentin> jsaw: wow - that was fast 22:52 < jsaw> hehe 22:52 < jsaw> hi valentin 22:52 < valentin> hi :) 22:53 < jsaw> Currently saving energy by using the car... 22:53 < jsaw> well, my energy :) 22:53 < valentin> hehe 22:54 < valentin> here in berlin using public transportation does not save much energy 22:54 < valentin> the city trains / subways are powered at 750 V 22:55 < valentin> do not ask me how much power is transformed into heat 22:55 < jsaw> tsss, yeah 22:55 < jsaw> how are the descendants? 22:56 < valentin> plural ? 22:56 < jsaw> who knows? 22:56 < valentin> i need to bring my daughter to bed now - together with my girl :) 22:56 < jsaw> (no, only used as idiom) 22:56 < valentin> jsaw: i saw the ultrasonic 22:57 < jsaw> :) 22:57 < valentin> my second child would be very good in hiding 22:57 < jsaw> exciting, isn't it 22:57 < valentin> so - have to leave now. maybe back later - maybe not 22:57 < valentin> yes, very exciting :) 22:57 < jsaw> cu valentin 22:57 < valentin> cu later 23:00 < rxr> mnemoc: the glibc built on sparc32 with v8 optimization 23:02 < rxr> are you sure the subway is powered by 750 V ? 23:02 < rxr> I somehow doubt that ... 23:06 -!- minto [~chatzilla@82-217-66-7.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:16 -!- sparc-kly [~sparc@64.237.138.134] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:18 < mnemoc> re 23:25 < rxr> hi 23:27 -!- Man0l0 [~mm@71-87-28.dial.terra.cl] has joined #t2 23:28 < mnemoc> hi 23:30 * rxr shower and then starting the crawling into bed 23:34 -!- Man0l0 [~mm@71-87-28.dial.terra.cl] has left #t2 [] 23:44 -!- Mech [~chatzilla@dsl081-073-058.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #t2 23:44 < Mech> whee! 23:44 < rxr> ~http://gcc.fyxm.net/summit/2003/mudflap.pdf 23:45 < mnemoc> Mech: hi Mr. iPkg 23:45 < Mech> mnemoc: Hey :-) 23:45 < Mech> mnemoc: you know - I still haven't played with iPkg ... 23:46 < Mech> mnemoc: right now, I'm trying to figure out how to handle build options for my lil toy system 23:46 < Mech> mnemoc: Just looking at curl - there's about 20 options that ./configure can take - krb libs, ssl libs, etc. 23:47 < mnemoc> Mech: what you tried T2's embeded target? 23:47 < mnemoc> have* 23:47 < mnemoc> rxr: interesting paper 23:47 < Mech> mnemoc: I played with it a lil... 23:47 < rxr> mnemoc: the gcc 4.0 feature I got curious about 23:48 < Mech> so I'm trying to figure out what to google for - there's gonna be an explosion in the number configuration options, and I'm trying to find research on it... 23:48 < Mech> I figured somebody working with weather data, or maybe physics data must have run across this problem before 23:49 < Mech> unfortunately, I can't find the 'right' keywords to feed google :-( 23:53 < valentin> re 23:56 < Mech> Hmm - it still bugs me scratchbox is gonna use GAR format for its recipes/meta-data :-( There's already several formats in use for this data - T2, OE, etc etc :-( 23:56 < mnemoc> rxr: the graphic effect you added to Emerge-Pkg makes me smile everytime i see it :D 23:56 < valentin> rxr: Technisch handelt es sich um zwei verschiedene Bahnnetze. Beide Netze benutzen die Normalspur (1435 mm Gleisbreite) und fahren mit Gleichstrom mit einer Spannung von 750 Volt. 23:56 < Mech> too bad they can't share the meta-data - it would lighten the load on everyone and make the meta-data more reliable 23:56 * mnemoc kicks valentin 23:57 < rxr> DC? Have they been drining too much ?!? 23:58 < rxr> mnemoc: good that I made you more happy ,-) 23:58 < mnemoc> rxr: thanks :) 23:59 < rxr> with updated .cache files with my reduced dependency noise Emerge will rock even more 8-) 23:59 < mnemoc> will you want my -rc1 cache files? 23:59 < rxr> yes --- Log closed Wed Apr 27 00:00:06 2005