--- Log opened Sun Feb 05 00:00:28 2006
00:21 < CIA-9> aldas * r15294 /trunk/package/gnome2/gnomebaker/gnomebaker.desc: * updated gnomebaker (0.5.0 -> 0.5.1)
00:22 < CIA-9> aldas * r15295 /trunk/package/network/ipsec-tools/ (ipsec-tools.conf ipsec-tools.desc): * updated ipsec-tools (0.6.4 -> 0.6.5)
00:47 < Baldzius> jsaw: libdvdread breaks gst-plugins, do something :)
00:52 < Baldzius> me in bed, gn8
00:53 < morfoh> gn8 update and gun master Baldzius .... :)
00:53 < morfoh> Baldzius: sleep well ;)
00:54 < Baldzius> thanks morfoh :)
01:10 < LMJ> evening
01:12 < morfoh> bonsoir serwou ;)
01:12 < LMJ> what's up morfoh ;)
01:13 < morfoh> I'm "up" because there is a party going on in the flat beneath :p
01:13 < morfoh> it's that loud, like I'd listening music in my room
01:13 < LMJ> lmao
01:13 < morfoh> but the differenc ei, that I don't listen techno
01:14 < LMJ> i'm back from a concert ;
01:14 < morfoh> oh! what kind of consert ? ;)
01:14 < morfoh> concert
01:15 < morfoh> techno ? :p
01:15 < LMJ> no
01:15 < LMJ> an old school dream ;)
01:15 < LMJ> english pop ;)
01:16 < morfoh> uhhhh! what band ?
01:16 < LMJ> Oasis :-p
01:16 < morfoh> arrrrrgggg :p
01:17 < LMJ> I know ;)
01:17 < LMJ> still under heavy drugs
01:17 < morfoh> LMJ: dunno what they are doing or not ;)
01:18 < morfoh> I'm in no way a pop fan, but I hope you enjoyed the concert :)
01:19 < LMJ> i'm not
01:21 < LMJ> but they are a part of my infancy, and i heard they come to my city, so i grad a ticker
01:21 < morfoh> why ?
01:21 < morfoh> ok ;)
01:23 < LMJ> and you, what kind of techno is it ? tech, hard-tech, trance, goa, jungle, drm-n bass, acid, electronica, hardcore ? ;)
01:26 < morfoh> LMJ: it doesn't matter what style ... atm it's more hardcore ... what matters is, that it is loud :p
01:30 < morfoh> I think the "Unstable Serial Bus" really deserves his name on 2.6.11.12 :(
01:31 < morfoh> even my mouse changing the acceleration speed ... one time it's lightning fast ... the other time dog slow
01:32 < LMJ> hehe
01:32 < LMJ> enjoy
01:32 < morfoh> and I forget to mention the IO errors I get for my external HD :/
01:32 < morfoh> LMJ: thanks my friend :p
01:35 -!- valentin_ [n=valentin@port-212-202-41-129.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #t2
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01:38 < morfoh> .oO( seems that the rat doesn't like the techno sound too ... guess I have to give him some devotion )o
02:23 -!- valentin [n=valentin@port-212-202-170-254.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #t2
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03:07 < madtux> hi.
03:15 < mnemoc> hi
03:25 < morfoh> madtux: hi pyromaniac
03:26 < madtux> hey there my friends :)
03:27 < morfoh> madtux: how much cost a rica = :p
03:27 * morfoh hides
03:28 -!- valentin_ [n=valentin@port-212-202-170-254.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #t2
03:28 < morfoh> madtux: how you doing these days ? ;)
03:29 < morfoh> damn ... now the f* people downstairs starting to sing ... it's even worser than this f* techno music
03:30 -!- valentin [n=valentin@port-212-202-170-254.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: 111 (Connection refused)]
03:32 < morfoh> madness ... they are drunken ... I can hear and smell it :p
03:35 < madtux> there is already alcohol in the air... light up a match and drop it downstairs...
03:36 < madtux> :)
03:36 < morfoh> madtux: that kind of hint I expected from you :p
03:36 < madtux> what are friends for?
03:36 < madtux> :)
03:36 < morfoh> ack :)
03:36 < morfoh> to burn :p
03:37 < morfoh> nah! ... just kidding :)
03:37 < madtux> BURN BURN BURN
03:37 < morfoh> HOLLYWOOD BURN
03:37 < madtux> i promisse the singing will stop
03:37 < morfoh> I believe in your experience :)
03:38 < madtux> yeah... my neightboors have not messed with me for years
03:38 < morfoh> good to know that your "meassures" are quite succesful
03:39 < madtux> :)
03:39 < madtux> do u have any suggestion for a simple and easy blog ? i don't want any heavy fancy php + mysql thing
03:40 < madtux> all i want is to make a page to write stupidities from time to time
03:40 < madtux> pics and articles of my pyro sucesses
03:40 < madtux> to share with friends
03:40 < madtux> :)
03:40 < morfoh> :)
03:41 < madtux> mm... my blog ... perl...
03:41 < morfoh> perhaps you should hackup a small script generating some static html and publish it with gatling ... :)
03:41 < morfoh> using a simple markup language
03:42 < madtux> morfoh, in fact i feel temptated to create tex files for my "articles" and just generate the html with latex2html
03:42 < morfoh> http://www.methods.co.nz/asciidoc/ <-- perhaps ?
03:43 < madtux> checking it out... if i am not happy with anything in the next hour i think i will just write my own thing
03:45 < madtux> mm.... this asciidoc thingy is kind of what i am looking for..
03:45 < madtux> thanks man :)
03:46 < morfoh> madtux: hehe ... I like it too ;)
03:46 < madtux> i will still write my own thing.. but mean while i will stick to it
03:46 < madtux> do u use it?
03:47 < morfoh> yes ... atm. for internal documentation ... and generating various output formats
03:48 < morfoh> ok ... senores & senoritas ... I think I'll take a short nap ... :)
03:49 < madtux> burn them first
03:49 < madtux> :)
03:49 < madtux> night buddy... i will be up late tonight if u feel like chatting or something
03:50 < morfoh> hmmm ... first I'll try to sleep, if I was not able to sleep within 1h I'll burn them :p
03:50 < morfoh> madtux: cu ... :)
03:52 < morfoh> bye bye ... :)
03:54 -!- morfoh [n=jeru@p54BEF420.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.11"]
04:47 < mnemoc> gn8 *
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07:07 -!- menomc is now known as mnemoc
10:04 -!- rxr_ [n=rene@e178162052.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2
10:04 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1.1 and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Say hello and do not hesitate to ask us any questions that you may have. | http://www.rafb.net/paste/
10:04 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Sat Jan 14 21:42:03 2006]
10:04 [Users #t2]
10:04 [@ChanServ] [ jsaw ] [ madtux] [ owl ] [ sepp ] [ _Ragnar_]
10:04 [ Baldzius] [ karasz] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ sparc-kly]
10:04 [ CIA-9 ] [ LMJ ] [ mtr ] [ rxr_] [ valentin_]
10:04 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal]
10:04 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
10:05 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 41 secs
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10:50 < rxr_> re
10:51 -!- You're now known as rxr
10:55 < sepp> hi rxr
10:58 < rxr> hi sepp
11:00 < sepp> do you have something like usr/X11R7/lib/xorg/modules/input/wacom_drv.so with modular xorg?
11:01 < owl> moin
11:02 < sepp> moin owl
11:02 < rxr> no, not on my laptop
11:02 < rxr> which might not have all input modules installed
11:03 < owl> hi sepp , rxr
11:03 < sepp> looks like i disabled too much xorg noise :)
11:04 < CIA-9> rene * r15296 /trunk/package/python/python/libdir-from-configure.patch:
11:04 < CIA-9> * fixed python to take {bin,lib}dir from configure and thus fixed it
11:04 < CIA-9> for lib64 architectures
11:04 < rxr> hm?
11:05 < sepp> all these really usefull little x apps and drivers i will never use
11:08 < rxr> ah - xedit ...
11:20 < CIA-9> rene * r15297 /trunk/package/base/ (linux26/disable-broken.lst linux26mm/disable-broken.lst):
11:20 < CIA-9> * marked EEPRO driver to be disabled, since obsolete and replaced
11:20 < CIA-9> by the e100 driver, do not have it arround and thus not load it
11:20 < CIA-9> accidently on matching IDs ..
11:26 -!- mtr_ [n=Michael@p54AFB005.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #t2
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11:44 < CIA-9> aldas * r15298 /trunk/package/gnome2/bluefish/ (bluefish.conf bluefish.desc shared-mime-files.patch): * updated bluefish (1.0.4 -> 1.0.5)
11:46 < Baldzius> moin
11:48 < rxr> re
11:48 < rxr> moin Baldzius
11:48 < Baldzius> hi rxr
11:49 < rxr> mnemoc: i think your problem is mostl probably due udev
11:49 < rxr> mnemoc: booted your iso in qemu ...
12:00 < rxr> mnemoc: misl: for the new t2 handbook we will most likely need java for the .pdf processing ...
12:13 -!- morfoh [n=jeru@p54BEF420.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
12:13 < morfoh> moin
12:24 < Baldzius> hi morfoh
12:32 < rxr> mon morfoh
12:48 -!- Baldzius [n=baldzius@85.206.96.178] has quit ["Leaving"]
12:49 < morfoh> moin Baldzius
12:49 < morfoh> moin rxr
12:50 -!- Baldzius [n=baldzius@85.206.96.201] has joined #t2
13:00 < morfoh> moin Baldzius :)
13:01 < Baldzius> :)
13:32 * morfoh is burning his new mnemosyne CD for the desktop :)
13:34 < morfoh> rxr: btw, did you checked mnemoc's mnemosyne test ISO for 2.2 ?
13:36 * morfoh is rebooting and installing the new system ... bbl ;)
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14:19 -!- sepp [n=sepp@p213.54.133.190.tisdip.tiscali.de] has quit ["Lost terminal"]
14:21 < mnemoc> moin!
14:21 < CIA-9> aldas * r15299 /trunk/package/scientific/octave-forge/octave-forge.desc: * updated octave-forge (2005.06.13 -> 2006.01.28)
14:22 < mnemoc> rxr: did stage2 load for you? (it didn't for morfoh)
14:22 < CIA-9> aldas * r15300 /trunk/package/scientific/graphviz/graphviz.desc: * updated graphviz (2.6 -> 2.8)
14:22 < Baldzius> moin mnemoc
14:23 < mnemoc> moin Baldzius
14:23 < rxr> mnemoc: nope - no /dev/cdrom
14:23 < rxr> mnemoc: did you have a /dev/cdrom ?
14:23 < rxr> it must be a problem with the recent udev ...
14:24 < rxr> mnemoc: what was your stage2 problem ?
14:24 < mnemoc> morfoh is out :)
14:24 < mnemoc> i didn't have /dev/tty either
14:25 < rxr> let me restart qemu
14:27 < rxr> hm - dev/tty is here in qemu
14:27 < mnemoc> kiss screamed about that here
14:27 < rxr> hm
14:28 < rxr> at what point_
14:28 < rxr> ?
14:28 < rxr> just 6: debug kiss shell ?
14:28 < mnemoc> yes
14:28 < mnemoc> it greet me with that scream :)
14:29 < rxr> just on debug shell? or already earlier ?
14:30 < mnemoc> just on debug shell
14:30 < rxr> ah there
14:30 < rxr> yes, that is harmless
14:30 < mnemoc> earlier i get an 'automatic' [0] with no device found; no device detected
14:30 < mnemoc> and manual [0] gives the same
14:31 < rxr> mnemoc: yes, no cdrom links aroun
14:31 < rxr> d
14:31 < rxr> due udev whatever
14:31 < rxr> ln -s /dev/hdc /dev/cdrom
14:31 < rxr> cures it for a test
14:32 * mnemoc miss devfs :(
14:32 < rxr> mnemoc: before other people bumped udev versions claimed to be tested udev worked for me ..
14:32 < rxr> mnemoc: with a devfs kernel you could also miss nodes or get strange ones but then you had to start debugging in the kernel
14:32 < rxr> in fact I have two mainboards where devfs causes very strage ide nodes ...
14:33 < mnemoc> :)
14:33 < rxr> like skipping host1 resulting in host0 host2 and the other one was even strange random swappong of primary vs. secondary or so ...
14:33 < rxr> notheless - I'll take a look what is up with that udev
14:34 < mnemoc> thanks
14:34 < rxr> any other problem when you symlink and thus get into the shell after stage2 loading ?
14:36 < mnemoc> let me test
14:38 < mnemoc> can udev make less overpopulated /dev-s ?
14:40 < rxr> sure
14:40 < rxr> just supply the rules for it
14:40 < rxr> I'm also happy to change the default rules to be less populated by default
14:40 < rxr> e.g. more devfs
14:41 < rxr> what udev did you exactly built into the iso ?=
14:41 < mnemoc> 083
14:44 < mnemoc> "unable to load NLS charset iso8859-1" <--- before loading 2nd_stage
14:44 < mnemoc> and during
14:45 < rxr> hm
14:46 < mnemoc> .oO( from mount -t $joliet? )o
14:46 < rxr> udev 083 does not even build here
14:46 < mnemoc> o_O
14:47 -!- sepp [n=sepp@p213.54.133.190.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #t2
14:47 < mnemoc> moving pty and tty deeper in /dev would clean it a lot
14:47 < sepp> re
14:47 < mnemoc> wb sepp
14:48 < sepp> hi mnemoc :)
14:48 < CIA-9> aldas * r15301 /trunk/package/network/socat/socat.desc: * updated socat (1.4.3.0 -> 1.4.3.1)
14:48 < rxr> what?
14:49 < rxr> on ppc64 this udev builds and on x86-64 not?
14:52 < CIA-9> sebastian * r15302 /trunk/package/x11/linuxwacom/ (linuxwacom.conf linuxwacom.desc xorg-7.patch):
14:52 < CIA-9> * updated linuxwacom (0.7.0 -> 0.7.2)
14:52 < CIA-9> * build the wacom xinput driver - modular xorg no longer has a own driver
14:52 < mnemoc> [ ] udev-083.tar.bz2 26-Jan-2006 20:00 191K
14:52 < mnemoc> [ ] udev-084.tar.bz2 30-Jan-2006 04:13 186K
14:52 < mnemoc> .oO
14:54 < rxr> I think that is the version with udevstart removed
14:55 < rxr> please do your heart a favour and stay away from udev hackery ...
14:56 < Baldzius> :)
14:57 < mnemoc> :)
14:57 < mnemoc> i'll follow your advice
14:58 * sepp repaired damn power supply with a hammer :)
14:58 < mnemoc> o_O
14:59 < sepp> now it no longer fails
15:00 < mnemoc> female power supplies
15:00 < sepp> power supply is female?
15:01 < mnemoc> yours
15:01 -!- Baldzius [n=baldzius@85.206.96.201] has quit ["Leaving"]
15:01 < sepp> no, after contact with a hammer its really dead and replaced
15:02 < mnemoc> but, yes... in spanish they are 'she' :)
15:02 < mnemoc> hehe
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15:06 < rxr> hm - parallel issue ?
15:07 < mnemoc> udev?
15:08 < rxr> hm - or ccache?
15:09 < rxr> at least restarting te build manaully helped ...
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15:15 < rxr> huh!"
15:15 < rxr> now it built
15:15 < rxr> damned buildsystem junk some people solder together
15:16 < rxr> mnemoc: I can reproduce missing /dev/cdrom on my laptop
15:16 < rxr> we should start creating really sane rules and setup a regression testsuite for udev on the way
15:16 < rxr> and if the udev people continue to piss on the world^W^W^Wannoy us udev++ is faster there than they can speak out "udev junk"
15:18 < mnemoc> ack
15:22 < nzg> moin
15:26 < rxr> hm
15:26 < rxr> udevtest claims it would create a symlink for hdc -> cdrom
15:26 < rxr> and why the hell doesn't the udev working horse does this
15:26 < rxr> my - doomed C rap code ...
15:33 < mnemoc> :)
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15:48 < rxr> so
15:48 * rxr back doing some archiv. work ...
15:49 < rxr> mnemoc: I continue to investigate the udev regression thereager
15:49 < rxr> thereafter
15:49 < rxr> you should have a fix in trunk when you come back from the party
15:49 < mnemoc> thanks :)
15:50 < rxr> thanks for testing trunk -,)
15:50 < mnemoc> np :)
15:50 < rxr> valentin_: btw. comments to gsmp -> exact-sound rename
15:50 < rxr> ?
16:35 < mnemoc> woh! terry mackintosh returned to RL
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17:21 < rxr> the islander?
17:21 < rxr> maybe he has more fun with t2 ?
17:30 -!- morfoh [n=morfoh@p54BEDCE2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
17:30 < morfoh> re hi :\
17:30 < LMJ> hello morfoh
17:30 < morfoh> hi LMJ
17:30 < LMJ> s'up dude ?
17:32 < morfoh> LMJ: dude ... at least my PC is up and running again ... I was fighting with the board
17:32 < LMJ> what happend ?
17:32 < morfoh> I installed a new mnemosyne
17:32 < morfoh> but that was not the problem
17:33 < morfoh> too much cards in the f* PC
17:34 < morfoh> and even my rock solid 3Com 905 NIC wasn't functioning ...
17:36 < morfoh> normally my plan was to "fight" with my Dual-Xeon machine today ... but now I'm "hanging" on the f* old athlon
17:37 < CIA-9> rene * r15303 /trunk/package/x86/dmidecode/ (. dmidecode.cache dmidecode.desc): * added dmidecode (2.8) - Reports BIOS information according to the SMBIOS/DMI standard
17:37 < LMJ> Dual-Xeon :-/
17:38 < morfoh> LMJ: why :\ ?
17:38 < LMJ> you just bough them ?
17:38 < CIA-9> rene * r15304 /trunk/misc/archive/iso2stick.sh: * added proof of concept ISO 2 USB stick converter
17:39 < morfoh> nah! It's an "old" machine
17:39 < LMJ> ha
17:46 < morfoh> .oO( damn ... why is the external HD that slow again ? )o
17:46 < LMJ> .oO( damn ... why stoped work correctly ? )Oo
17:46 < LMJ> FUCK
17:48 < morfoh> I think I've to reboot again :(
17:48 < morfoh> bbl ... :(
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17:49 < CIA-9> rene * r15305 /trunk/package/base/ (2 files in 2 dirs): * fixed a typo in the usb*xchange code
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18:21 < morfoh> rehi
18:23 < morfoh> rxr: btw, do you have an old "tonband geraet" ?
18:25 -!- morfoh [n=morfoh@p54BEFE08.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit]
18:32 < rxr> re
18:32 < rxr> morfoh: a normal tape analog tape, yes - and at my father a refox 19" or so tape as well ...
18:36 < rxr> revox even
18:46 < rxr> http://www.reeltoreel.de/worldwide/B77.htm
18:46 < rxr> ^- something like that
19:09 < rxr> jsaw: are you around for some udev discussion
19:09 < rxr> jsaw: I find the disks by id and path and so on extremely annoying
19:09 < rxr> /dev/'disk/by-id/ata-HL-DT-ST_DVD-RW_GCA-4080N_K5B0BD14735
19:09 < rxr> /dev/disk/by-path/pci-0000:00:14.1-ide-1:0
19:09 < rxr> pure crap
19:09 < rxr> jsaw: I would remove those
19:10 < rxr> as I woudl the various cdrw recorder whatsoever duplicants
19:10 < rxr> this udev noisy is barely useful ...
19:10 * rxr back to dinner
19:10 < rxr> would be nice if you could drop a note about those ...
19:13 -!- misl [n=chatzill@82-217-66-150.cable.quicknet.nl] has joined #t2
19:13 < misl> hi folks
19:28 -!- morfoh [n=morfoh@p54BEFE86.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
19:28 < morfoh> rehi :/
19:36 < misl> hi morfoh
19:37 < misl> morfoh: again pretty close timing. only 15 minutes difference in joining :)
19:39 < morfoh> hi misl ;)
19:48 < morfoh> does somebody has a msdos boot floppy image ?
19:49 < LMJ> morfoh : google for it
19:49 < LMJ> you will find some
19:50 < morfoh> LMJ: thanks ... but I found one already ;)
20:27 * morfoh flashing the bios ... bbl ...
20:27 -!- morfoh [n=morfoh@p54BEFE86.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]
20:38 < CIA-9> aldas * r15306 /trunk/package/mail/dbmail/dbmail.desc: * updated dbmail (2.0.7 -> 2.0.8)
20:45 -!- sparc-kly [n=G3@64.237.253.75] has joined #t2
20:53 < jsaw> rxr: we have to do a lot to clean up udev rules (by path-id etc included). I think the first step should be to tear it into pieces.
20:53 < jsaw> rxr: there are way too many (and on our system unneeded) backwards compat stuff in the readhat rules
20:54 < jsaw> hehe
20:54 < jsaw> redhat*
20:56 < rxr> re
20:58 < jsaw> rxr: is it correct that the boot image does not have grep?
20:58 < rxr> hm
20:59 < jsaw> rxr: (there's a grep for http/ftp installation
20:59 < jsaw> only
20:59 < rxr> yes
20:59 < rxr> hm
20:59 < rxr> then I forgot to add it
20:59 < jsaw> o.O
20:59 < jsaw> ah, ok
20:59 < rxr> but the grep could be replaced with sed anyway
20:59 < rxr> sed -n //p ...
21:00 < jsaw> I wanted to use it for "grep /sys/*/*/removable
21:00 < jsaw> "
21:00 < jsaw> grep 1 *
21:00 < rxr> I used a bash loop in the new archivista code
21:00 < rxr> + for x in /sys/block/*/removable ; do
21:00 < rxr> + [ `cat $x` = 1 ] || continue
21:01 < jsaw> rxr: could you please check some bootdisk and verify if you have /dev/{cdrom,floppy} links?
21:01 < jsaw> ah, ok
21:01 < jsaw> nice
21:01 < rxr> jsaw: last week I had
21:01 < rxr> with mnemoc I do not have
21:01 < rxr> because of latest udev buggyness
21:01 < jsaw> actually I thought, there
21:01 < rxr> udevtest for /block/hdc tells me it would create the symlink
21:01 < rxr> but neither udevstart nor udevd does create it ...
21:01 < jsaw> yes
21:01 < jsaw> right
21:02 < jsaw> that's what I observed but was not sure
21:02 < rxr> udevtest /block/hdc
21:02 < rxr> create_node: creating symlink '/dev/cdrom' to 'hdc'
21:02 < rxr> create_node: creating symlink '/dev/dvd' to 'hdc'
21:02 < jsaw> but that needs the rules
21:02 < jsaw> we don't have 'em on install disk, or?
21:02 < rxr> # rm -rd /dev/cd*
21:03 < rxr> # udevstart
21:03 < rxr> # l /dev/cd*
21:03 < rxr> ls: /dev/cd*: No such file or directory
21:03 < rxr> # echo 1 > /sys/block/hdc/uevent
21:03 < rxr> # l /dev/cd*
21:03 < rxr> ls: /dev/cd*: No such file or directory
21:03 < rxr> how broken is that
21:03 < rxr> crap ever changing C code ...
21:03 < jsaw> do you have my new rules???
21:04 < jsaw> rxr: it's mostly redhat rules brokenness
21:04 < rxr> I reemerged today for testing
21:04 < jsaw> and cdrom_id ?
21:04 < rxr> hm ?
21:04 < jsaw> what does /sbin/cdrom_id /dev/hdc tell you?
21:04 < rxr> # /sbin/cdrom_id /dev/hdc
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_CD_R=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_CD_RW=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_DVD=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_DVD_R=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_MRW=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_MRW_W=1
21:04 < rxr> ID_CDROM_RAM=1
21:05 < rxr> btw. I find this extremely awkward
21:05 < jsaw> hmmm.
21:05 < rxr> I neither want this complexity and I rather doubt it is of any use
21:05 < jsaw> ?
21:05 < rxr> I want a u/dev(++) create plain normal nodes not do articifican inteligence crap
21:05 < jsaw> with this, the rules are four line
21:05 < rxr> hal can give /media/ mountpoints meaningful names
21:06 < jsaw> ???
21:06 < rxr> but totally messed up /dev if of no use for anyone
21:06 < jsaw> only dvd,cdrom link should be created
21:06 < rxr> jsaw: four line?
21:06 < jsaw> I commented cdrw etc out
21:06 < rxr> all nodes get kernel names and cdroms enumerated to /dev/cdrom%e
21:06 < rxr> thats all
21:06 < jsaw> KERNEL=="hd[a-z]", BUS=="ide", IMPORT{program}="/sbin/cdrom_id --export $tempnode"
21:06 < jsaw> KERNEL=="sr[0-9]", BUS=="scsi", IMPORT{program}="/sbin/cdrom_id --export $tempnode"
21:06 < jsaw> ENV{ID_CDROM}=="1", SYMLINK+="cdrom%e"
21:06 < jsaw> ENV{ID_CDROM_DVD}=="1", SYMLINK+="dvd%e"
21:06 < rxr> I know
21:06 < rxr> this sucks
21:07 < rxr> majorly
21:07 < jsaw> why?
21:07 < rxr> who need such names? and what for?
21:07 < jsaw> oh, you mean, you don't want the cdrom,dvd links at all?
21:07 < rxr> it just results in everyone hunting their devices nodes
21:07 < rxr> cdrom and dvd - but not the reminder
21:07 < jsaw> what reminder?
21:08 < rxr> cdrw cdrecorder dvdrw whatsoever ...
21:08 < jsaw> isn't done... o.O
21:08 < jsaw> we don't have them... O.O ????
21:08 < rxr> O.O ?
21:08 < jsaw> I don't understand the point...
21:09 < jsaw> we only cread cdrom and dvd links with the 4 lines above
21:09 < jsaw> create*
21:09 < rxr> the point is all the floating udev rules in the internet suck - because they create a overly shuffled and messed up /dev
21:09 < jsaw> oh, that you mean
21:09 < rxr> and the recent by id stuff ..
21:09 < jsaw> yep, that's why I say we should split the rules...
21:09 < jsaw> then we can more easily find (simpler) solutions
21:09 < rxr> in disk I have a whole mess
21:10 < rxr> and I'm also unsure if /lib/udev is nice
21:10 < rxr> just annoying complexity to carry to initrds and such
21:10 < jsaw> actually we do not need /lib/udev
21:10 < rxr> or sbin
21:10 < rxr> sbin/cdrom_id
21:11 < jsaw> then tell me how you want to create a _simple_ rule, that also does the dvd link
21:11 < rxr> in fact I do not care a bit over the dvd link
21:12 < jsaw> don't get me wrong, cdrom_id can be done in a few lines of shell code! So we will definitely replace it!
21:12 < jsaw> rxr: I do
21:12 < rxr> maybe just use the helper for the dvd link - but create the cdrom with classic ways not requiring an external too
21:12 < rxr> l
21:12 < jsaw> I don't want to modify the configs of some applications on every installation
21:12 < rxr> jsaw: well, ok the dvd with external tool is ok - it is not needed for booting
21:13 < rxr> l /dev/
21:13 < rxr> Display all 601 possibilities? (y or n)
21:13 < jsaw> l /dev |grep -v tty | grep -v pty|wc -l
21:13 < jsaw> 78
21:15 < rxr> hm - damn
21:15 < rxr> I wanted to paste a devfs comparision
21:15 < rxr> but gsmp has compat enabled for all
21:15 < rxr> l /dev/
21:15 < rxr> Display all 1190 possibilities? (y or n)
21:15 < rxr> ah here we go:
21:16 < rxr> too few, bash completion displays them all:
21:16 < rxr> # l /dev/ | wc -l
21:16 < rxr> 57
21:16 < rxr> ^- _that was neat_ ,-)!
21:16 < jsaw> yeah
21:17 < jsaw> why don't we go with debians devfs naming rules?
21:17 < rxr> they use external tools?
21:17 < jsaw> lemma check
21:17 < rxr> well, let's not try to mimic devfs totally
21:17 < rxr> e.g. the /dev/sd /dev/hd and so on a too much linux standard
21:17 < rxr> they should be there
21:17 < rxr> but the rest most probably not
21:18 < jsaw> yes, they use external tools
21:18 < rxr> yes, disqualified
21:18 < rxr> but we do not need external tools
21:19 < rxr> e.g. I do not want /dev/ide and /dev/scsi back
21:19 < rxr> they are too non-standard
21:19 < rxr> just not the terminals and other insane stuff out of the root should be fine
21:19 < rxr> and less external tools as possible
21:19 < rxr> so far I see the need for the /dev/dvd tool and my dvb remaning script
21:20 < rxr> jsaw: I can safely remove the persistent by-name fluff from the buttom of our config ?
21:20 < jsaw> (not mine, redhat)
21:20 < jsaw> yes
21:20 < jsaw> even by-*
21:21 < rxr> jsaw: do you have a locally modified config ?
21:21 < jsaw> yep
21:22 < jsaw> but only slightly different from t2's
21:22 < rxr> hm
21:22 < rxr> do we need this modprobe $modalias ?
21:23 < jsaw> not sure
21:23 < jsaw> actually I think hotplug should handle it
21:23 < rxr> ..oO
21:23 < rxr> we have two hotplug++ rules
21:23 < jsaw> yep
21:24 < CIA-9> rene * r15307 /trunk/package/filesystem/udev/50-udev.rules:
21:24 < CIA-9> * removed persistent naming junk from the redhat based udev rules we use
21:24 < CIA-9> and a second hotplug++ rule
21:28 < jsaw> the "sr[0-9]" to "scd[0-9]" naming convention is also a bit strange
21:28 < rxr> ack
21:28 < rxr> it is redhat compat junk
21:28 < rxr> let me tweak it
21:28 < jsaw> :)
21:29 < rxr> huh!
21:29 < rxr> there is KERNEL=
21:29 < jsaw> ?
21:29 < rxr> that will not work with latest udev, will it ?
21:29 < jsaw> line?
21:29 < rxr> dr
21:29 < rxr> err
21:29 < rxr> sr
21:29 < rxr> scd
21:29 < rxr> sg
21:30 < jsaw> ohoh
21:30 < jsaw> see also first line!
21:30 < jsaw> msr
21:30 < jsaw> cpu
21:31 < jsaw> I don't have these lines anymore locally, but those I stated -^
21:31 < jsaw> only those*
21:31 < rxr> # rename sr* to scd*
21:31 < rxr> my oh my ...
21:33 < CIA-9> rene * r15308 /trunk/package/filesystem/udev/50-udev.rules:
21:33 < CIA-9> * fixed some = vs == in the udev rules, removed some legacy redhat
21:33 < CIA-9> junk on the way
21:34 < rxr> jsaw: we could patch at least our kernel to export the cdrom media types to sysfs
21:34 < rxr> thus we would not need external tools at all
21:34 < CIA-9> jsaw * r15309 /trunk/package/develop/librep/ (4 files):
21:34 < CIA-9> * fix building of librep (64-bit)
21:34 < CIA-9> * copyright updates
21:36 < jsaw> rxr: isn't it contained in /proc/ide/hdc/identify ?
21:37 < rxr> no idea
21:37 < rxr> but proc is not sysfs anyway
21:39 < jsaw> I prefer this small helper tool...
21:39 < jsaw> over patching the kernel
21:43 < rxr> why do we have /dev/pts*
21:43 < rxr> they should be in /dev/pts ...
21:43 < rxr> pty even
21:48 < rxr> my - the rules are ugly
21:48 * rxr going to bed
21:48 < rxr> mnemoc: your cdrom issue is nto yet solved in hear
21:48 < rxr> head
21:48 < jsaw> rxr: /proc/sys/dev/cdrom/info <-- here's the info
21:48 < rxr> n8 all
21:48 < jsaw> gnight rxr
21:48 < rxr> jsaw: oh - what a useless format
21:49 < rxr> should be per device attributed in sysfs ...
21:49 < rxr> n8 anyway
21:49 < rxr> need to get up early
21:49 < rxr> and susan is waiting ..
21:49 < jsaw> cu
21:55 -!- morfoh [n=morfoh@p54BEFE86.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
21:55 < morfoh> rehi :)
21:55 < jsaw> hi morfoh
21:55 < morfoh> hi jsaw
21:58 -!- misl [n=chatzill@82-217-66-150.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
22:14 < jsaw> have to leave too, cu
22:15 < morfoh> cu jsaw
--- Log closed Mon Feb 06 00:00:34 2006